(Photo: Felipe Morin)
Holy crap. The 4-Hour Body (4HB) has ended up producing an avalanche of questions.
There are definitely a few gems hidden amongst the rubble, and more than a few typos were unearthed in the process.
This post — mostly how-to with a few bits of entertainment — is purely for tying up loose ends. I hope it helps.
Covered in this post:
The blog moving forward: 4HB content vs. 4HWW content vs. random topics
4HB Bonus Materials – If You Missed It
4HB Tools and Tricks – All Online!
Contest winners
Slow-carb clarifications
4-Hour Body – common questions and Q&As
Audiobook PDF downloads
4HB reader-generated goodies: desktop wallpaper, etc.
Media samples
4HB corrections and typos…
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The blog moving forward: 4HB content vs. 4HWW content vs. random topics
Some readers have expressed interest in more business-related posts, instead of physical-focused posts. Not to worry — there will continue to be both on this blog. In simplest terms, I write about what I’m most interested in (or passionate about) at the time. If you don’t find a post interesting, skip out for a bit and then check back in. I don’t expect anyone to read all of my posts.
4HB Bonus Materials – If You Missed It
The 4-Hour Body bonus materials have been up for a while now. If you missed them, all can be found here. Enjoy!
There are a number of forums and message boards for 4HB, including this blog and the reader-generated 4HBTalk.
For those interested, I’ll be experimenting with a private, paid forum (probably $9.95/month to start, but not sure) for 4HB. I’m going to test it with 100 people first. If you have any interest in being one of the 100 for $9.95/month, please fill out this form. My hope is that this forum can be a central troll-free and spam-free gathering point for people who are willing to test, gather data, and contribute to each other. I don’t want participants who ask others to Google simple questions for them. The price is a simple mechanism to separate out those who are most serious.
Regardless, information wants to be free. There are a ton of free resources and communities online, not to mention a 600-page book, that should be enough for anyone to make exceptional progress.
4HB Tools and Tricks — all online!
Ever wished all of links in the 4-Hour Body “Tools and Tricks” were online? You asked and I heard you — all of the resources links are now online here. Enjoy!
Contest winners!
CONTEST #1
Blog post: Have a Good Eye for Ads? Try the (Lucrative) 4-Hour Body Experiment…
Date: October 13
Winner: Salman Sajid (Congratulations!)
Prize(s): North Face Prophet 65 Trekking Pack (Retail: $319), A round-trip anywhere in the world Star Alliance airlines fly (or $1,000 cash), All 4-Hour Body revenue via ads on my site for two weeks (potentially every post ever written), using your Amazon affiliate code.
Notes: Here is Salman’s winning ad (he also won the smaller banner), based on click-through rate. I’ll be doing a longer analysis in a future blog post. The genius “Eat Like Santa, Look Like Jesus” ads, which I also used to great effect, was designed (visual and copy) by Conway Anderson. Amusingly, he and I randomly met on the Embarcadero sidewalk on the SF waterfront. He gave me his card “just in case” and here we are.
CONTEST #2
Blog post: “The Land Rush: 48 Hours to Claim $4,000,000 in Prizes” + “The 4-Hour Body is NOW OUT – Live Q&A Today, New Trailer, Free Books, and Much More”
Date: December 2010 (sadly, there were some great submissions who posted too late, like David Batchelor)
Winner: Camille. Runner-up: Roger P.
Prize(s): Free trip to the person who promotes The 4-Hour Body best this week. If you are the best promoter, judged by me and a panel of friends, you get to pick one trip of a lifetime… for free. I will almost definitely be in attendance: 8-Day Argentina Snow Adventure in Patagonia, or 10-Day Private Tour of India, including Miss India. Includes roundtrip economy airfare from and back to the U.S. Addendum: I’ll give the runner-up a round-trip anywhere in the world that Continental flies (or StarAlliance). Camille, you can also take this, if you prefer. No expiration date.
Slow-Carb Clarifications
I’m currently getting at least 500-1,000 questions a day via the blog, Twitter, Facebook, etc. about the slow-carb diet. Let me clarify a few things:
Do not eat the following, except for cheat days:
Yams
Sweet potatoes
Quinoa
Dairy (this includes cheese and yogurt of all kinds)
I mention cottage cheese at one point as a last resort. It is low in lactose, which is what you need to avoid. Ghee and cream (for coffee) should contain little or no lactose, hence you can use them. The same goes for effectively lactose-free, unflavored whey protein, etc..
[Note for the PubMed readers: It’s true that whey is partially (or wholly) responsible for the insulinemic response of most dairy, but avoiding lactose seems to be more directly correlated to faster fat-loss in the diet subjects I’ve tracked. Needless to say, avoiding all dairy is the simplest solution.]
SUPPLEMENTS: There is NO need for supplements on the slow-carb diet, besides magnesium, potassium, etc. in “Slow-Carb II.” PAGG is NOT necessary, so if you find it confusing, just omit it.
Post-workout carbs – If your goal is fat loss, and assuming you are not training for endurance competition:
– If you male and not 12% bodyfat or less, no post-workout carbs.
– If you are female and not 20% bodyfat or less, no post-workout carbs.
In the end, the point of 4HB is intelligent and responsible SELF-EXPERIMENTATION. I will not answer all of your questions, precisely because I want you to think for yourselves and figure it out. Hundreds of you have already done so. It’s not that hard.
The following will address 99%+ of confusion:
– If you have to ask, don’t eat it.
– If you haven’t had blood tests done, I don’t want to hear that the diet doesn’t work.
– If you aren’t measuring inches or haven’t measured bodyfat % with an accurate tool (BodPod, etc. and NOT bodyfat scales), I don’t want to hear that the diet doesn’t work.
– If you’re a woman and taking measurements within 10 days prior to menstruation (which I advise against in the book), I don’t want to hear about the lack of progress.
– On the critical 4-6 week window:
For people over 40 and women (especially after two kids), it’s quite common that the most dramatic fat-loss and weight change comes after 4-6 weeks on the diet. I have no explanation for this. Needless to say, if you haven’t done the diet for AT LEAST four weeks, please don’t post a comment about plateauing and panicking. I can’t give you meaningful advice without a ton of other supporting data (blood tests, etc.), and it’s physically impossible for me to respond to each person.
To reiterate: The entire goal of 4HB is to make you a self-sufficient self-experimenter within safe boundaries. Track yourself, follow the rules, and track the changes if you break or bend the rules. Simple as that. That’s what I did to arrive at my conclusions, and that’s what you will do — with a huge head start with the 4HB — to arrive at yours.
Do it for 4 weeks and then troubleshoot if you’re plateauing.
If you post a plea for help anywhere, include at least two FULL days of your meals and snacks so people can actually help you.
Most of those saying they’re “following the diet to the letter” are doing nothing of the sort. Reread “Slow-Carb II” in 4HB.
Last, I’ll repeat the basic approach to the unknown: If you have to ask, don’t eat it.
4-Hour Body – common questions and Q&As
Most of the questions you could possibly ask about 4HB or slow-carb have been answered, whether related to carb-loading for endurance, orgasms, or other. I’ve done a few Q&As over the last few weeks, and I encourage you to check them out — lots of good questions:
4HB Presentation and extended Q&A at Twitter Headquarters [VIDEO]
4HB Presentation and extended Q&A at Twitter Headquarters [AUDIO] (after clicking the link, just wait 45 seconds to download the file for free)
Presentation and Q&A at Google Headquarters (the preso is the same as Twitter, but the Q&A is different and starts at 18:00)
Audiobook PDF downloads
The PDFs that accompany audiobook downloads (which I have nothing to do with) are apparently really hard to find. Please note: on Audible and elsewhere, there should be a small download link on your purchase confirmation for downloading the PDFs.
4HB reader-generated goodies: desktop wallpaper, etc.
Just for the fun of it, here is some desktop wallpaper created by Cole Morgan.
Media Samples
If you’d like to see how you must compress your sound bites for television, here is a brief clip of me from The View. I REALLY want to get Barbara Walters huge on creatine. She’d look amazing with killer forearms:
I will also be on Dr. Oz this Monday (Jan 24), and it should be a much longer segment and worth seeing. Find your local times here. I’ve been on his radio show twice, and we’ve always had a good time digging into the details. He doesn’t hesitate to challenge.
4HB corrections and typos
Through the editing process, which included more than six passes of the manuscript and a team of copyeditors, typos inevitably ended up in 4HB. I’m thankful to you, my readers, for pointing most of them out. Here are those we’ve found so far. These are my notes sent to the publisher, so forgive the odd formatting, and most bolding has been removed:
1) HUPERZINE DOSE TYPO, PG. 280
“As I double-checked pg.280 of your 4-Hour Body book, I see that you indeed recommend 200 milligrams of the extract, however, the reader suggested that … it should, in fact, be 200 MICROgrams.”
TIM: I’m not sure how this happened, but he’s right. It should be “micrograms (mcg)” NOT milligrams. Please change to “micrograms (mcg)”
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2) IODINE TYPO and add to biotin, PG 524
“Hello,??I noticed two typos on page 524:??* Iodine does not have a USRDA value of 1,500 mcg…it is actually 150 mcg.”
TIM: This is correct. Please change to 150 mcg. I don’t know how this happened, as it was accurate at manuscript stage. Needs to be “150 mcg”
“?* Biotin does not have a USRDA value of 30 mcg…it is actually 300 mcg.”
TIM: He is incorrect here, I believe, but we should still update, as Biotin does not have an USRDA. Put “(no USRDA)” next to biotin like a few others.??
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3) CINNAMON TYPO, PG. 101
“Under DAMAGE CONTROL you state that during your binge you consumed 1 tbsp cinnamon in your coffee. However under THE GLUCOSE SWITCH, when explaining types and quantities of cinnamon you stressed the importance of not exceeding 1.5 teaspoons a day. Which would mean you had consumed double that “safe” amount during your binge. Can you please clarify?”
TIM: “1 tbsp cinnamon” on pg. 101 (under “12:45pm”) is a typo and should be “1 tsp cinnamon”
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4) PG. 26
“That is, if you’re a critical intervention patient, such as a morbidly
obese type 1 diabetic.”
Should be changed to “type 2”:
“That is, if you’re a critical intervention patient, such as a morbidly
obese type 2 diabetic.”
###
5) PG. 116, PAGG
The end result was PAGG.
Policosanol: 20–25 mg
Alpha- lipoic acid: 100–300 mg (I take 300 mg with each meal, but some
people experience acid refl ux symptoms with more than 100 mg)
Green tea fl avanols (decaffeinated with at least 325 mg EGCG):
325 mg
Garlic extract: 200 mg
Daily PAGG intake is timed before meals and bed, which produces a
schedule like this:
Prior to breakfast: AGG
Prior to lunch: AGG
Prior to dinner: AGG
Prior to bed: PAGG
Should be changed to (changes in bold):
The end result was PAGG.
Policosanol: 20–25 mg
Alpha- lipoic acid: 100–300 mg (I take 300 mg with each meal, but some
people experience acid reflux symptoms with even 100 mg)
Green tea flavanols (decaffeinated with at least 325 mg EGCG):
325 mg
Garlic extract: at least 200 mg (I routinely use 650+ mg)
Daily PAGG intake is timed before meals and bed, which produces a
schedule like this:
Prior to breakfast: AGG
Prior to lunch: AGG
Prior to dinner: AGG
Prior to bed: PAG (omit the green tea extract)
6) PG. 120, PAGG PARAGRAPH AND TOOLS AND TRICKS
[SECOND PARAG]
“Until further research concludes otherwise, I suggest using an
aged-garlic extract (AGE) with high allicin potential that includes all constituent parts, including S-Allyl cysteine.”
Should be changed to [changes bolded]:
“Until further research concludes otherwise, I suggest using an
aged-garlic extract (AGE) with high allicin potential that includes all constituent parts, including S-Allyl cysteine. If AGE isn’t available, unaged garlic extract appears to work at slightly higher doses.”
[CHANGES IN TOOLS AND TRICKS]
I currently use the following products. I have no financial interest in any of them:
Vitamin Shoppe— Allicin 6000 Garlic, 650 mg, 100 caplets (www.fourhourbody.com/garlic)
Mega Green Tea Extract (decaffeinated), 725 mg, 100 capsules (www.fourhourbody.com/greentea)
Vitamin Shoppe— Alpha- Lipoic Acid, 300 mg, 60 capsules (www.fourhourbody.com/ala)
Nature’s Life— Policosanol, 60 tablets (www.fourhourbody.com/policosanol)
Should be changed to (please just copy and paste the below):
I used the following products for my testing, but I’ll update links based on availability and reader feedback. I have no financial interest in any of them:
Allicin 6000 Garlic—650 mg, 100 caplets (www.fourhourbody.com/garlic)
Mega Green Tea Extract— 325+ mg EGCG, 100 capsules (www.fourhourbody.com/greentea)
Vitamin Shoppe—Alpha-Lipoic Acid, 100 mg, 60 capsules (www.fourhourbody.com/ala)
Nature’s Life— Policosanol, 60 tablets (www.fourhourbody.com/policosanol)
###
7) CHANGE “Heinrich” to “Henrik” on pg. 256, parag 3
###
8) PG. 15 — “500 scientific citations” needs to be changed to “300 scientific citations”
The Tim Ferriss Show is one of the most popular podcasts in the world with more than one billion downloads. It has been selected for "Best of Apple Podcasts" three times, it is often the #1 interview podcast across all of Apple Podcasts, and it's been ranked #1 out of 400,000+ podcasts on many occasions. To listen to any of the past episodes for free, check out this page.
Comment Rules: Remember what Fonzie was like? Cool. That’s how we’re gonna be — cool. Critical is fine, but if you’re rude, we’ll delete your stuff. Please do not put your URL in the comment text and please use your PERSONAL name or initials and not your business name, as the latter comes off like spam. Have fun and thanks for adding to the conversation! (Thanks to Brian Oberkirch for the inspiration.)
HI Tim hi everyone. Ok so I finally found the answer from Tim at the top of this blog.
I have to say I’m very disappointed with this answer from Tim
“Last, I’ll repeat the basic approach to the unknown: If you have to ask, don’t eat it.”
My thoughts on this are, maybe Tim doesn’t find enjoyment from eating and uses food as just energy. Is it called the slow carb diet or the Tim Ferris diet?
If this is going to be a long term thing for us, then we need to know buddy. We cant live the rest of our lives eating food based on vague guidelines.
I can tell you the system works for me, I feel better, smarter, sharper and loosing body fat like its melting off my body. With the help of the Kettleball swing, anyone can do this.
But please if someone has a question to the most important and critical part of the regime, you say dont ask? sounds like a bit of a cop out to me.
With all the staff and the funding, it wouldn’t take much to put up a list of the foods and fluids you can and cannot eat. Users could contribute it would take nothing at all and then you would stop getting a gazillion emails.
Ok so you answered the sweet potato question great, what about the others?
Sweet corn?
Are all white beans ok, butter beans, haricot?
What about grass fed Lamb?
Grass fed beef, can we eat the fat or does it have to be lean?
What about baby coconut water?
We can eat chicken breast and thigh but can we eat the skin?
Popcorn?
In the book you say we can eat parmesan in the white kidney bean mash, yet you say no cheese of any kind in this post can you confirm im confused?
What about swede?
You give the impression in the book that the chipotle diet is good, the guy has sour cream, can we have this?
What about bamboo shoots and beansprouts used in stir fries?
Mushrooms?
Hemp milk, it is dairy and soya free?
You ask for people to contribute to recipe’s but how can we if we dont know what is ok to include.
Help us to help ourselves?
Thanks for understanding 😉
Bud,
I totally hear your frustration. I felt the same way after I read Tim’s book. There were a lot contradictions and I’d read one thing in one part of the book and then something in another part and get confused as to which information went with what. In the end I did get a complete answer from Tim and that is: It’s all about self experimentation. The 4 hour body is a report of what Tim found worked for himself and others who were willing to experiment right along with him. And through the course of that experimentation he found some things that seemed to work for the majority. He shared those, and pretty much the rest is up to you to figure out for yourself. That’s why we have this forum. So that we can share what works for us personally, and help each other out of the ruts. Pain in the rear eh?
That being said, I realize that when you first jump into this “diet” it feels like there aren’t really enough rules and regulations. “Can I eat this” or “When exactly do I take this?” are questions that have come up for many of us. And waiting and experimenting take time. I get it. I don’t want to take time, I want to lose this flipping weight and other people report they’ve lost a zillion pounds in two days and I want to too. RIGHT NOW!
Therefore, start small. Eat what you know is okay and then, once you’ve lost some weight and are on a roll then add in the coconut water. Does it slow things down, speed things up? How do I feel when I drink this? I’ll tell you that when I eat sugar, either in the form of fruit or chocolate or pie or other sweet things it makes my tongue raw now. Almost immediately I feel it on my tongue. I don’t have to go any further than that. I know it’s a cheat day item if it makes my tongue feel raw.
Now, since you are very interested in coconut water and I happen to have a bottle of it that I’m supposed to review for my website, I have a label to read. Mine has aloe vera added and says it’s got coconut water, aloe, and fiber in it. It’s got 9 grams of sugar and 16 grams of carbs. I’m sure you know the benefits of coconut water and I understand why you’d like to drink it.
My personal opinion (which I realize you asked for Tim’s, not mine, so do with it what you will) on it would be that I wouldn’t drink it instead of water. Always replenish with water first. Instead, if it were post workout and I needed the lift I would skip the beans (or decrease the portion) at lunch and try drinking the coconut water instead. I would stick with only one portion per day and increase it only when I was sure it wasn’t affecting my weight loss.
I too would love to know about the parmesan cheese (and I have wondered about the Chipotle diet guy as well eating sour cream). I could experiment with it but I haven’t taken the time. Anybody else?
Chicken skin is very very fatty and generally a bad choice (I butcher my own chickens and blech, I would not eat the skin!). I’d say skip it. Bamboo shoots in a stir fry are generally such a small quantity that I wouldn’t worry about those personally. Lamb is a very fatty meat but I do know that Tracy Rifkin eats lamb (her favorite meat she says) and keeps her weight down. I do not know how frequently but I do know she cooks it primarily in her pressure cooker.
Hope that helps. Any change you make towards eating whole foods that are not processed is a step in the right direction. Good luck!
Alison
Hahahahaha! If I had just been more patient and read a little more before posting my previous question, I would have had the answer…please ignore my post with exception of the soybean issue noted. I would still like to know your findings on that if further study is pursued.
Thanks!!
YO Tim,
I think there has been enough people asking the question about coconut water.
Can we drink it. It would make a big difference if we could.
Please please please please answer this one question and I’ll never bother you again.
Coconut water yes or no thats it.
Cmon everyone join in, ask the question.
COCONUT WATER can we do it or not?
Its simple BABY COCO NUT WATER.
Yay or Nay?
Cmon one of you moderators find out for us?
BABY COCONUT WATER?
Its got to be allowed check out the nutritional facts per 250ml
Calories – 45
Sugars -11 g
Sodium – 30 mg
Total Fat- 0 g
Potassium – 515 mg
Total Carbs -15 g
Calcium- 4% RDA
Vitamin C 175% RDA
Saturated -0 g
Polyunsaturated -0 g
Dietary Fiber -0 g
Monounsaturated -0 g
Trans -0 g
Protein -0 g
Cholesterol -0 mg
Vitamin A 0%
Iron 0%
That has to be enough information for Tim or one of his team to find out if this is ok or not.
RSVP
Hey Bud,
I don’t know what Tim’s answer would be but I understand the process of noodling out what I would do.
First of all understand that the Slow Carb Diet is a low sugar/glycemic index whole food diet. Foods that are not whole foods and get the majority of their calories from simple sugars without some healthy fat or fiber to slow the insulin uptake/response are not foods that this diet is built around.
Feel free to try and tweak the SCD to your tastes if you want, but first try following sample meal plans to a tee and confirm that your diet is dialed in and working for you before you try integrating a sub-optimal food derivative product like “coconut water”.
I wouldn’t myself but there are more then one way to experiment with the boundaries of diet in the chemical laboratories that are our bodies.
Good luck
Etienne
I checked the composition of the carbs in coconut water and (no surprise) they are glucose and fructose. Sugars (and fruit) are not allowed on the diet, except on cheat day. Coconut water appears to be the equivalent of diluted fruit juice, as far as the sugar composition is concerned.
Alison &B Etienne,
Thank you so much for you comments, appreciate when someone takes the time to respond.
Alison, I did find a response from Tim to someone about the Chipotle diet buried somewhere in this post amongs thousands of posts and his comments were that you should not have the sour cream. I think he uses examples of other diets and when people skim through the book you kinda tend to get confused.
A good way if you haven’t already worked out to find information about a particular subject or food is to go to the post, click CTRL F then search for the word and you’l see anything related to the topic. If the post has more than one page, you have to conduct the search again on the next page. Hope this helps.
I nearly cocked up and was about to bake a sweet potato until I searched the post and found a comment from Tim about avoiding until cheat day. That would have annoyed me if I had just blown 3 days of strict dieting. But that’s what I mean, people need to know and a central point where common/obvious foods that people may or may not eat is quite important if we are to stick at this for a long time.
Thanks Etienne, I think that based on the fact that I have no idea if its going to hinder progress, I think I’ll just have to wait for beer day I mean cheese day I mean cheat day and drink a litre of the damn stuff.
There are some issues with the book but I have to thank Tim for providing this information to the world. I mean the guy has been documenting and experimenting since he was 16. The diet works no question of doubt. The kettleball swing works and it was worth the money just to find out those parts.
I think its pathetic that people on the net blog about rude and insulting remarks about the guy. Hey no one is perfect and for that penelope bird, well I think she just fancies him but cant get a slice.
Tim has shared the knowledge and for less than the price of a few beers, you can be on the road to living longer, feeling stronger healthier and looking great. People charge 100’s if not thousands to provide this information.
I cant tell you guys how my mind is working right now, probably at about 110%. Cognitive improvement, focus and clarity.
I tried the cabbage soup diet once and it worked but after about 6 months the weight comes back.
The concept of the slow carb diet is well, life changing and the longevity of it for me at least is the fact that you can pig out an all of the things you covet on the 7th day, which I have timed to be a Saturday.
Before I was blind and now I see very clearly indeed.
Cheers Tim (as I sit here with a nice glass of Pinot Noir with about 5kg less fat on me than last week)
Good luck guys enjoy your new life.
I have a question about the amount of almonds I can eat.
I am following the diet for those trying to lose the last 5 to 10 Lbs..According to pg 150 of THE 4-HOUR BODY I can choose among 5 meals to eat every 3 hours. If I choose options 1, 2, or 3 that means that I can eat 30 ( a quarter cup of nuts for those who weigh less than 150) almonds at each of my 5 meals. That would be 150 almonds a day. That seems like too many. Can I really eat that many almonds?
hey elo,
Swami says (not me the guy sitting cross legged floating over my left shoulder)
You need your calories from somewhere. (You’ll get +/- 978 calories from the nuts and not too much from the lean protein) The math here adds up (I don’t argue with the swami).
This last mile diet is just that. A drug free pre-contest cutting regime. I suspect that you wouldn’t want to live on it forever but if you want super low body-fat and you are already in the sub 8-10% body-fat range this diet will likely get you there. (I’m about 4.5 miles behind you)
Good luck
Best,
Etienne
Thanks etienne,
I have been sooo tired while on the Last Mile Diet diet, but unlike the regular 4HB diet, I didn’t think that I could increase calories because the options are very specific. I will go ahead and eat the amount of almonds specified to see if that helps with the fatigue. My mom is on the same diet and she is about to quit for the same reason. We seem to be missing something. I hope we can figure it out.
I switched to this way of eating about 9 months ago and have never felt better,I also have a sweet tooth and have found that protein shakes help curb that craving
I have no criticism for 4HB. First off the book is crazy informative and also funny (really, weigh your food on a date? Classic). My goals are pretty simple, I am a male, weigh 190lbs, with 16%BF +/- 3% according to a handheld measurer I cant remember the name of. My goal weight is 175. I know the slow carb diet works, when I was overseas and unable to work out, I still lost weight. But now I have started P90X and stick to the slow carb diet, but I have come back up to 190lbs and its not going down. I know Tim is a big advocate of the minimal effective dose, but I MUST work out to maintain strength for my job as a fire fighter. I simply cannot let myself get weaker, for me its actually a mater of life and death. So how can I continue to maintain strength AND lose weight to my goal?
@Travis
This is meant only for you and your specific situation. It is bound to create some knee jerk reactions and distinction at my expense but here I go:
Mark McManus who is the trainer that runs http://www.MuscleHack.com has tons of loyal followers. He maintains you can gain muscle and cut fat using his TSPA book. I am doing that and I am living proof. This is for you Travis. Thanks for being a fireman.
I think Tim Ferriss created a paradigm shift. You could feed a 3rd world country on the money I’ve spent on buying his book to give away. He makes it clear it all about insulin, no matter how you cut it.
Travis…
I’d be willing to bet if you are on the SCD and P90X that you are packing on a good deal of muscle. This is why your weight has gone back to 190#. Check that BF again and see if it’s not way down from the earlier 16%.
If not, then another possibility is you are not eating enough protein to compensate for the P90X regimen.
My money’s on the former…
Also, I’ve found some research on the positive effects of adding BCAA to you pre and post workout meals/supplementation. I’ll post it in a day or so…
I am having trouble getting my breakfast together within the first 30mins as it takes me that long to down my coffee and drink my ice water while making breakfast. Most days by the time I get everything done I have just exceeded the hour limit. I tried boiled eggs, but even with the baking soda I’ve had trouble extricating the eggs from the shells withing 30 minutes because nothing seems to work for me. I was only successful with one egg. It doesn’t help that my husband, who has no faith in this diet telling me I should be going to the gym everyday, eating less…in other words doing it the tried and true way of less in and more aerobic out. He saw your segment on Dr. Oz but, but won’t read the book. Plus, his schedule is variable and mealtimes every four hours are becoming hard to maintain and I have had a 3lb weight gain after my binge and another lb gain noted Sunday morning days after my binge day on Friday so I must be doing something wrong. Could the meal timing or, the cottage cheese I add to lunch and sometimes dinner be my downfall?
7:00am wakeup 7:10am coffee 1 cup with cinnamon, 7:30am two huge glasses of ice water (I haven’t measured the amount, but I am using big pub pint glasses…not sure what that measures out to mg) while fixing breakfast
my typical breakfastThursday and Friday (pre binge) was:
2 eggs scrambled with tobasco sauce (only because I was out of cholula sauce)
1 cup spinach salad with approximately 1 tbspn of balsamic vinigrette I make up ahead and use all week (1/2 cup olive oil, 3 tblspns dijon mustard from Whole Foods (no sugar, apple cider vinegar, mustard and white wine) 1/2 tspn white wine vinegar, 1 large clove garlic, crushed to a paste and aged for 15mins to develop allicin, salt and pepper to taste. I crumbled 1 slice organic bacon and shave a little red onion.
1/2 cup cottage cheese
1/2 cup black beans with 1 tblspn no sugar salsa picante ( tomato, onions, peppers)
lunch Thursday (at 1:00pm…wasn’t hungry at all at noon and made myself start making lunch at 12:45pm to accommodate husband’s schedule
1/3 lb hamburger patty (100% grassfed 9% fat organic beef)
1/2 cup black beans with hot sauce (good thing I love black beans)
1/3 cup cottage cheese (fed about 2 tblspns to puppies because I couldn’t finish it)
3 slices of beefsteak tomato
( should I be adding more steamed veggies here and eliminating the cottage cheese?)
Dinner Thurday 8:00pm (started at 6:30pm but have three dogs to feed who won’t eat dog food…this definitely slowed me down and I have changed their scheduled feeds to compensate)
1 6oz pork chop, broiled with garlic and olive oil brushed on
1/2 cup cooked swiss chard
1/2 cup cooked white navy beans (wasn’t sure if these were allowed, but figured they’re beans…let me know if I am wrong)
1/3 cup organic red table wine
12:30 My binge consisted 4oz glass grapfruit juice of a bento box lunch of Teriyaki beef, 6 Gyoza, 4 California rolls, small seaweed salad with cucumber miso soup and 2 cups green tea
60 seconds of air squats in restroom following lunch
2 glasses Ice water and ice pack on neck and shoulders for half hour after returning home…nap for 1 hr.
3:00pm 2 Barbara’s organic no sugar or sodium added shredded wheat bisquits with 4 strawberries, and 1/4 cup blueberries with 2 tablespoon agave syrup and 1/2 cup milk. 1 small sweet potato.
7:00pm dinner
1 cup homemade eggplant spaghetti sauce (1/4 cup olive oil, 1 lrg chopped onion, 5-6 cloves crushed garlic, 1 tspn red pepper flakes, 1 tspn ground oregano, 1 large egglplant diced into 1/4″ dice, 1 can organic italian whole peeled plum tomatoes, 1 can tomato paste and 1 cup organic red wine)
1 cup cooked pasta
2 oz each fresh grated organic raw milk parmesa and pecorino romao
2 slices italian sourdough bread with garlic butter (mine has 50% butter, 50% olive oil, clove of garlic crushed and aged for 15 mins, very finely chopped shallots, 1 tspn fresh chopped organic rosemary, 1/8 tspn ground oregano, 1-2 leaves basil chopped, 2 tblspns each finely shredded parmesan and romano).
1/3 cup glass of organic red wine
8:00pm – 1 cup Haagan-Daas 5 vanilla bean ice cream topped with 1/2 cup white peaches peeled sliced and sauteed with 1/4 cup honey, 3 tablespoon lemon juice, 1 tspn cinnamon.
1 8 oz. glass unsweetened red tart cherry juice. I didn’t go to sleep until midnight…I was too sugared up.
Saturday (7:00am woke up grouchy from binge day – same routine and timing for coffee and water except forgot to pick up eggs at store the day before)
breakfast 8:03 am
1/2 lb hamburger patty (organic grass fed) with onion sauteed in with the hamburger with a little low sodium soy sauce – approximately 1 tablespoon
1/2 cup cottage cheese
1 cup spinach salad
at 10:00am I had a little dizziness and figured it was from my blood pressure medications (25mg each atenol a beta blocker which slows rapid heartbeat and hydrochlorothiazide to control water retention) and I increased water intake and laid down for a while…I have since decided to eliminate the medication except for binge days since I don’t seem to have a problem with water retention, but having trouble keeping myself stocked with toilet paper due to added trips to the bathroom to pee ;-D
lunch 12:30 (actually got close to the four hour window with this one)
Chili – 1/3 lb hamburger (organic grass fed) with 1 tspn spicely organic chili con carne spice, 1/2 tspn spicely organic ground chipotle, 1/4 tspn spicely organic ground california chili,
3 tablespoon tomato based, no sugar salsa with onions and peppers)
1 tspn brine and 6 or so pickled jalapenos
topped with 1/2 cup cottage cheese
1 cup spinach with balsamic dressing – no onions or bacon this time
Dinner…sigh 8:00pm again
6 oz Broiled skinless, boneless organic chicken breast with garlic and olive oil brushed on
1 cup home prepared dried lima beans with salt pepper and 1 tspn butter
1/4 lb steamed broccollete with salt ( I use lite salt as Tim suggested to increase potassium consumption)
1/3 cup organic red wine (groundswell…light like a pinot)
I haven’t been able to get the PAGG supplements…I am 61yrs old hypothyroid (take meds), menopausal due to a hysterectomy 6 yrs ago (no hormone replacement) and hypertensive (meds noted above) and haven’t the money to get my blood tested yet, but plan to schedule next payday on this coming Friday. It may take a while because I am on Healthy San Francisco…sometimes take 3-4 weeks to get an appointment) I did have measurements and my body fat measured at the gym which I joined last Wednesday…scary 38% with calipers (7pts) but hope to get it measure more accurately sometime in the future, but will have to save up for it. I also intend to get a food scale at some point since I would like to track my nutritional intake as well as portion amounts. I go to the website that listed nutritional values, but wonder about their accuracy because of measurement flaws…hard to tell how much is in that 1/2 cup veggies or, meat without a scale due to size of chunks, etc.
Is there anything I should change besides trying to get a larger variety of veggies?
Hi Cathy,
Regarding easy peel hard boiled eggs, I had the same issue and found a blog with a method that works better for me. I will provide the link but if it doesn’t work, the blog is called Choosing Voluntary Simplicity. I don’t know about anything else on the blog but the easy to peel hard boiled eggs method works!
http://www.choosingvoluntarysimplicity.com/easy-to-peel-hard-boiled-eggs/
Hi Cathy,
Good news!
If you’re having trouble following SCD and therefore the results aren’t quite what you’d hoped for, you should be able to straighten things out in short order. Really this stuff works.
Let me take it a piece at a time and I’ll tell you what works for me and we’ll see how much of that you can make work for you.
>I am having trouble getting my breakfast together within the first 30mins as >it takes me that long to down my coffee and drink my ice water while >making breakfast. Most days by the time I get everything done I have just >exceeded the hour limit.
1. Easy. Start with a blender whey protein shake to be sure you easily get enough protein (you can skip this step but instead hold off on the ice water start with a whey protein blender shake. Try ice + almond milk, whey protein + low glycemic index sweetener, cinnamon + 1/8th can of coconut milk. All ingredients are optional except for the protein powder)
This way come to the worst you’ll your 35 grams of protein in you in 5 minutes + the time it takes to swallow 16 ounces of yummy drink.
The rest will be so quick you can enjoy your drink with an omelet if you’d like.
2. Whenever you prepare fresh veggies, dice a few extra keep in a zip lock bag for breakfast. (Just make sure you always have a bit of onion + mushroom in there)
Put a little coconut oil or Kerri Gold sweet butter in a pan saute your veggies for a few minutes (Start your coffee)
Pour in several eggs worth of egg whites from a carton. Fold over your omelet when its done.
3. Pour your coffee and your protein drink sit down and enjoy your omelet. Total elapsed time = 3 shakes of a lambs tail, or about 20-25 minutes if you dawdle.)
4. Drink you ice water when you do the dishes.
Your husband thought wonderful and very smart in most other respects is at best only partly right here. Certainly eating a little less helps with weight loss. Going to the gym helps a little but only a very little. Any strength and conditioning coach would tell you you need to focus on diet if its weight loss (or fat loss) you’re after. The exercise part will make you look better, feel better and probably live longer. So by all means go to the gym. Just don’t count on being able to lose much body-fat if that is the cornerstone of your plan.
Increase your protein to 1 gram per lb of body-weight. Add fish oil up to a tablespoon after each meal. Start eating your protein portion then switch to veggies when you are almost full. (See Chris @ Athletic Greens famous email / post for details)
>I tried boiled eggs, but even with the baking soda I’ve had trouble >extricating the eggs from the shells withing 30 minutes because nothing >seems to work for me. I was only successful with one egg.
Put eggs in a pan with water to cover, bring to boil. Remove from heat. Leave covered 12 minutes. Run under cold water until cool. Roll your eggs on your chopping block or counter. When you’ve cracked the shells like spider glass they should peel easily enough.
>He saw your segment on Dr. Oz but, but won’t read the book.
Tell him to read the first 70-100 pages or buy him the audio book.
Once you get breakfast timing down, up your protein, and maybe start with high dose fish oil you’ll be the one laughing. Skinner but laughing.
Good luck. Let us know how you do.
Best,
Etienne
Hi Cathy,
My regime might add some light, might not.
within 30 minutes of waking up I’ve mixed 30 grs of protein powder in water and gulped it down. Then I’m off to the gym trying to get through my weightlifting routine within 1 hour of drinking the protein powder and water.
2 hours after drinking the PP, I’m having my SCDish breakfast, main meal of the day. Should I miss the ablility or opportunity for any main meal on schedule, I always carry some BCAAs to swallow with water and might even go so far as a Nalgene with protein powder and MCT. Just extreme cases like traveling or long bike rides. I don’t believe too much protein powder in a day is a long term solution, but it’s better than an occasional gap with no protein. BCAAs are interesting because they contain 3 essential amino acids that the muscle uses directly for MPS instead of going through the liver. Buy capsuls of BCAA, powder tastes like caca. Also, one of the BCAA’s, L-Leucine, is the definition of how effective a protein source is to MPS. Hence, soy has less, egg is the standard, and whey has the highest per n-amount of L-Leucine. Disclainer: I googled all this, I’m not a doctor or trainer. (friend at the gym today said “you’re arms are huge!!” heh heh nice friend
John,
The reason your arms are so big is that you peddle with your feet. Try it the other way round and they’ll even out soon enough.
Best,
Etienne
I am taking a gram/10lbs of body weight of high quality pharmaceutical grade fish oil in the morning and evening. It’s easier for me to divide these into two doses when I am home. I’d like to know if there’s any problem with that and again what this quantity of fish oil provides.
Additionally, I used to run before starting the SCD but have switched to the ab and kettlebell exercises outlined in the book. I ran for so long with little effect on my weight but wonder if I need to be doing it still. Should kettlebells plus the floor exercises Tim outlined be enough? I’m doing them 3 days a week.
I can definitely see my body transforming and am grateful for this way of life. My only recent concern is I have noticed I am waking easily at night lately and seem to wake multiple times. That’s the only reason I don’t feel as energetic as normal with this lifestyle.
Thank you for any input. These posts have been beneficial to me.
Dividing your fish oil 1 gram of fish oil per 10-15lbs of body-weight in two or even three/four daily doses is fine, The amount you are taking is high, and that may-not be a bad thing. I take about the same amount relative to my body weight. You can look at reducing it by as much as half when you can see your abs sitting down. Basically sub-8-10%.You can also cut back after 60 days if you like, provided you eat nothing but clean protein. I’m not able to do this myself but if you consume nothing but wild caught fish, grass fed beef very little chicken etc. you might try less fish oil. Still for most of our diets it works as a palliative fix for the excess of omega 3’s.
Waking up frequently at night could be a sign that you sufferer from a bit of hypoglycemia, This might be wants going on if you go to sleep several hours after your last meal as we are all taught to do. My son and two of my best friends have had trouble sleeping and the thing that seemed to have helped them more then anything is a tip I picked up from Tim (go figure) about taking a large spoonful of almond butter just before bed.
Personally I say limiting work outs to kettlebells plus the floor exercises Tim outlined is enough. You can always add back more running later. Give yourself a break for a few weeks and see if maybe you don’t sleep a little better by doing just a little less.
Sleep is a deep topic and there are lots of books. Dark room no LED(S), no laptops in bed etc.
Whatever you do focus on fixing your sleep.
Good luck.
Best,
Etienne
Thanks to pdxHollym and Etienne for the helpful hints…had breakfast within a half hour of waking for the first time this morning, however, finding the gym crowded this morning, I found myself waylaid too long there and missed lunch by an hour…sigh and then a half hour at dinner…wish my huzzy would go on the diet with me, but he is stubborn. Perhaps if I can get results he will relent, however, being post menopausal and hypothyroid, I don’t expect to see muchin the way of weight loss, but I have already seen a few measurement improvements that are encouraging. Thanks for the help.
Thought I’d share my most recent slow carb breakfast with all of you. It’s simple, delicious and leaves me full for a good 3-4 hours. If you want to see exactly how I make it you can click on my name (above) to go to my site (healthnutnation.com) and it’s the video on the front page called “Sausage Avocado Egg Scramble.” Enjoy!
Finally got brave enough to post a progress update. 25 Lb in 7 months. Sounds like standing still compaired to all the other success stories but this is amazing results for me. Really an average of 1# per wek. 57 yr old female 80# overweight at start, low exercise level.
I think we are doing 80% of things right. Things we ( husband is losing too) do right: Good breakfast ( in the 1 hour window, can seem to get it down to 30 min) , Beans in moderation at 2-3 meals day, try to have at least 2x more veg volume than protein, Cheat Day! I think the cheat day is really the big difference for me. My metabalisim normally slows to zero on most diets.
Try to do an Ice pack on the back of my neck for 15-20 min every night, Get the PAGG combo down 2x a day( can’t seem to remember the miday).
Sorry for the long post, will update again at 50 lbs.
Hi,
You mention not to use cheese, because of lactose. It is my understanding that goat cheese does not have lactose. Would this then be ok to have?
Hi Lisa,
My understanding is that Goat’s milk also contains 7% less lactose than cow milk. It is certainly is easier to digest, and maybe less bad for you but my assumption is that it too would be verboten on the SCD diet.
The good news is that if you can stick to it for a while and follow along strictly (6 days a week) SCD will almost certainly work for you.
Good luck!
Etienne
Quick tip about hard boiled eggs. You can pre-peel them,rinse, and store in a covered glass container with a folded up paper towel at the bottom. They’ll last a good 4 days that way- but I bet since they’re already peeled they’ll be gone sooner!
Tim, Charlie or whomever might have an answer,
I was re-reading page 111 about fermented foods and am wondering about both kefir and yogurt (unsweetened). Both are fermented and listed as “healthy and fat-reducing gut flora.” I usually ferment both of these myself but have stopped because they are dairy based and dairy (with the exception of cottage cheese) is said to have a bad effect on insulin.
Kombucha is also listed, and I see that Tim lists it on one of his cheat days.
I am wondering if any of these three items would be considered acceptable on the SCD (not cheat days)? I can always do my own experiments but that takes time, and as usual, I would like to know sooner rather than later.
BTW, I made my own sauerkraut today so I’ll be sure to report back if I’ve had success!
On those nights I’m not enjoying ice cream after my unicorn steak I usually settle for yogurt.
You’re always squelching my dreams Etienne! 😉
Alison,
Sorry for being snide. I do miss my own home made yogurt, but at least I have your ice + almond milk + protein powder (+ coconut milk) smoothies to look forward to:-)
Anybody recommend any Kettle Bell video besides the Russian Door DVDs? (Sorry if you’ve posted an answer to this question before. I’ve just set up my work out room for Kettle Bell swings. The cat better look out!)
Best,
Etienne
Just a few comments.
Etienne, you are providing lots of good content (this has kinda become the Etienne and Alison Show, since Tim is off doing other things). One tweak I would like to point out is regarding your advice on fish oil supplements. Our modern diet is too high in Omega 6 oils, not Omega 3. Fish oil specifically has extremely high Omega 3 content and we should consume it to redress the imbalance re: Omega 6. I think you know this and it is just a typo or something that has propagated through your posts.
A question I have vis a vis your various recommendations regards your reference to “bodyweight”. Do you mean absolute bodyweight or lean bodyweight? It can mean a big difference in dosage of whatever you are referring to.
I am going to go out on a limb here and predict that there will never be an “Official 4HB Forum”, paid or not. For those who have read “4 Hour Workweek”, it should be obvious that Tim is not a business guru or a fitness guru; he is (trying to be) a man-of-the-world and these ventures are funding his pursuit of grass-fed Argentine girlfriends, or whatever. A paid forum would require the one thing he is most protective of: his time.
Hi William- Thanks for your comment. We actually had a paid forum for awhile that we tested with a small group of people, but ended up shutting it down because the platform was too unstable. It was a bad experience for everyone, and we refunded the few hundred people who had paid to test it out.
The official 4HB forum is coming, I can assure you. We’re juggling multiple projects at any given time, so while we’ve wanted to launch a forum FOREVER, we want to do it right, and just haven’t been able to hammer it out yet.
Charlie
Wonderful! I am extremely happy to be wrong on the forum issue. I look forward to it.
William,
>Omega 6 oils, not Omega 3.
Our diets should be supplemented by Omega 3, such as those found in fish oil as you say.
Dyslexia raises its ugly head. I seem incapable of seeing my errors on the page. I will endeavor to slow down. (I have an editor for my technical writing during my day job)
Undoubtedly the Inuit, who have been known to consume over a kilo of fat from fish a day, must be getting quite a lot of omega 3 in their diets.
According to the guidelines I have read I am on the high side for where I am today. I take +/- 1.0g for every 15lbs of body-weight (not lean body-weight) (Check the actual EPA/DHA content of your fish oil and only count the combined total towards daily intake requirements)
People who are sick (insulin resistant, inflamed, suffering autoimmunity) n-3 intake should be in the 1.0g(EPA+DHA)/10lbs body-weight/day.
Eventually people can titrate down to ~.25g of n-3/10lbs body-weight/day.
Thank you William!
William,
I have “The 4 Hour Work Week” sitting on my table waiting to be read. Somehow, it hasn’t happened yet b/c I’m always on this dang blog! It’s all becoming clear now….I’m totally being used.
That being said, I already have my own “show” ( click on my name and you’ll get to actually see me making a 4 hour breakfast- exciting stuff) now all I need is Etienne to make a guest appearance. Etienne, you can bring your fish oil!
I hope you know I’m writing this all in good fun. It’s not meant to be snarky. I generally appreciate someone that speaks their mind (in a respectful manner of course).
I have just started the SCD and am eliminating coffee mainly because there is no possible way I could enjoy it without splenda and a whole lot of flavored dairy creamer! As you probably expect, I love coffee candy – not actual coffee. As a substitute I have been allowing myself to indulge in a periodic stick of Extra sugarfree gum. Is this a deal breaker? Should I just try to break my sweetness “need” another way? I am chomping on a stick as I write this – any help would be greatly appreciated.
Tim
First things first I need to let you know that your book has been a watershed moment for me. Your style of writing and explaining things clearly has been a breath of fresh air. Cutting through all the bullsh1t that is around.
I do have one question for you or the collective. I have just started the SC diet and you mention drinking massive amounts of water without giving a ball-park quantity. I am currently drinking approx 3 litres of plain water and another 1.5 litres of tea/coffee. The net result is that I will have to move my work desk into the toilet I am there so much.
What would you consider enough fluids a day.
Keep you the good work.
Col
Colin,
Remember that anything with caffeine is a diuretic, which impacts how much water you need to drink as well as the number of times you’ll need to use the bathroom.
However, there is such as thing as drinking too much water and at 3 litres a day (12 cups) I’d say that’s plenty (depends on your height/weight, amount of salt and/or caffeine you’ve ingested, etc). It does sound like it’s kind of getting balanced out with the 1.5 litres of tea/coffee though. I might lessen the amount of tea/coffee but I wouldn’t up the water.
Alison
Thank you so much for your reply. Let me give you a bit more info. I am a 35 year old male at 200lbs 6ft. The tea I drink is almost exclusively green and I only drink 1-2 cups of coffee a day.
I was after a ball park figure as I know too much water can be harmful. I did read on one site that 6 litres was not an unreasonable amount to have daily !! I know it’s very much a case of ‘how long is a piece of string’ but thanks for the help.
Kind Regards
Colin
Jean,
Look for a Trident gum that you might like that contains xylitol instead of aspartame or Splenda. Xylitol is good for your teeth and also does not impact blood sugar. That being said, if Tim can get away with a diet coke a day, I’d think you could get away with a stick of gum or two.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Health_effects_of_coffee
Contrary to popular belief, caffeine does not act as a diuretic when consumed in moderation, and does not lead to dehydration or to a water-electrolyte imbalance; current evidence suggests that caffeinated beverages contribute to the body’s daily fluid requirements no differently from pure water.
^ Really? The Claim: Caffeine Causes Dehydration The New York Times
^ Armstrong LE, Casa DJ, Maresh CM, Ganio MS (2007). “Caffeine, fluid-electrolyte balance, temperature regulation, and exercise-heat tolerance”. Exerc. Sport Sci. Rev. 35 (3): 135–140. doi:10.1097/jes.0b013e3180a02cc1. PMID 17620932. (Review article, free full text available at Medscape with registration)
^ Armstrong LE, Pumerantz AC, Roti MW, Judelson DA, Watson G, Dias JC, Sokmen B, Casa DJ, Maresh CM, Lieberman H, Kellogg M. (2005). “Fluid, electrolyte, and renal indices of hydration during 11 days of controlled caffeine consumption”. Int. J. Sport Nutr. Exerc. Metab. 15 (3): 252–265. PMID 16131696. (Placebo controlled randomized clinical trial)
^ Grandjean AC, Reimers KJ, Bannick KE, Haven MC (October 2000). “The effect of caffeinated, non-caffeinated, caloric and non-caloric beverages on hydration”. J. Am. Coll. Nutr. 19 (5): 591–600. PMID 11022872.
HI – working my way through the book – fabulous! I understand recommending people who don’t eat breakfast at all to start eating the morning protein, and people who eat the wrong breakfast to change. I LOVE eggs and spinach and will love to eat that every morning, BUT is “within 30 minutes of waking” critical, and why (science please)? My only workout time is in the morning (I set the alarm early twice a week) and I eat the protein after that (maybe an hour or hour and a half after waking, then shower & head to work) Does that ruin the effect somehow? I am not skipping breakfast, and not skipping the morning load of protein. However, I WILL skip the workout if it has to happen in the evening – too tired, and looking forward to that glass of wine!
thanks
Hi Scottie,
Before we get to the science part lets see if you buy my rational for believing why it works and is integral to success on SCD.
I imagine its about the insulin(response).
Break-fast. As in break your nightly fast with a protein meal when you wake. With a little prep work for the week and either a quick shake in a blender, or egg whites in a microwave or pan, you can prepare breakfast while your coffee is brewing.
The science part (think time and motion study) is learning what to do with your hands in what order for the 20-30 steps that when mastered begets breakfast in 7-10 minutes.
No need to skip your workouts just get with the program. It works and you’ll do great!
Best
Etienne
I’m wondering if anyone can help me … Its a simple question but what are the quick meals that you take to work with you that require little to no energy to make and assemble quickly before going to work. =) So far I’m just taking a half a chicken breast to tide me over during the day, because the protien lasts a good while in my stomach and I’m not hurngry until I’m home. Should I be taking the beans and greens too or is it not a huge deal you think?
Ashley,
Finally a question I’m qualified to answer! (I pack my wife’s lunch).
Personally I don’t believe in snacks and therefore I think that every meal should be a complete meal. For me that means protein, healthy fats and veggies. In that order.
When I don’t have time to make a full salad to go with the eggs, flank steak or whatever protein I put into the bag lunch I always make sure to include a romaine (lettuce) heart a few mushrooms/carrots and some sweet red pepper or a handful of cherry tomatoes.
Easy enough to do what not make your lunch a treat instead of just fuel?:-)
Best,
Etienne
Loved the book and the way it’s written. Simple to follow and have started last week. Did some research and chose a constant measurement process for both body fat, total inches and weight as suggested. Tracked daily and first weeks results were great despite feeling pretty nasty by day two. Day three was way better and haven’t looked back since. No cheating on the diet but seems like I don’t have the same energy I used to, for getting out for a run.
First cheat day was interesting but I don’t know that I really want the thngs that I had craved again(sweet tooth here). Results were a 6 pound loss of weight and just over four pounds of it being calculated as fat loss. Not a bad result for the efforts and no excersize to achieve it. At 51 YOA that’s pretty good I figure.
Thanks for the book and sharing your perspectives, It was worth reading and getting into for me. Going to start the PAAG this week too and give it a bit more effort on the physical side to track what that may do to enhance it for me. Will let you know how it goes
I am struggling with super slow progress and want to get your input. Started 6/10 @ 280 lbs with 44.5″ waist. On 8/5 @ 272.6 with waist at 43.5″.I follow the diet 6 days per week and eat like an idiot on cheat day. Reviewing the past several weeks of meals, my transgressions have been on occasion having more than the two drink max of red wine and an occasional (once per week) bowl of popcorn. I eat breakfast within the 30min window. My typical meals are 1 8oz chicken breast, 1/2 cup black beans or lentils, and spinach or brocoli. I usually have the same for every meal, except switching out the protein. (Usually 3 meals per day) Sometimes I have Isopure unflavored protein shake in the morning if I don’t have any ready made chicken, fish, or beef. The shake delivers 26grams of protein per scoop and I usually have between 1and 1/2 and 2 scoops mixed w iced water. For exercise: I am recovering gym rat who eagerly gave up the 1hr workouts for kettlebell swings 2-3 per week. Currently I’m doing 75 swings with 50lbs kettlebell. I’ve read and re-read the book several times as well as gone through the posts here and am confused about a frequent recommendation: lowering the amount of beans consumed. This seems to be counter to a critical tenant of SCD. Also if the recommendation is to increase protein, by how much should I increase? Surely at 272 lbs the recommendation can’t be 272 grams of protein ?! One last thing, my water intake is @ 2.5 liters per day on average. Thanks in advance for any help. This diet makes sense to me and I feel if I just make the right tweaks, the weight and inches will start to fall off.
Paul,
It looks like you are getting very little fat in your diet. Etienne is going to tell you to take fish oil and I’d recommend that as well. Throw half an avocado in the mix, or maybe some oil drizzled over your beans. You may be able to see my lengthy post to Ashley with other ideas of things to eat (if they approve it).
My second guess is that you may not be eating enough in general. Are you feeling quite full on the amount you are eating now?
Update
Just re-searched the forum and got Etienne’s suggestion on fish oil: in my case it looks like 27 grams!Good Lord! willing to give it a try though… Still need help on protein suggestions, KB swings, and overall amount of food.
Thanks again everybody! This is so cool to have a community of people sharing info and supporting each other!
Paul,
I started @ just shy of 280lbs in Dec. A few months after getting going I GREATLY increased my protein and then balanced my omega 3/6 with high dose fish oil and added MCT fats from coconut milk.
Truthfully I don’t do cheat days or eat any beans/legumes at all, although I do not think this explains my success since I lost plenty of weight when I did.
Anyway I’m now 219lbs and that is up 7-8 lbs since I been doing kettlebell swing supersets with dead-lifts over the last 10 days or so. [I started circuit training with some very fit older ladies to get ready for weight training a few weeks before this.] (*do not attempt deadlifts or supersets based on anything I might tell you, please)
Protein, ideally grass fed on the hoof, wild caught fish. (Look out for too much clucker. Much of what I consume is not grass-fed hence the importance of the fish oil)
Protein comes nicely packaged with healthy fat (in the case of grass fed or wild caught) Do not be afraid to eat a lot of it. I consume over 220 grams of protein a day. My waist is now 36.5 inches or so, down from maybe 46+ in December.
Cut back on your cheat days. Start with a SCD breakfast and consider going crazy for a cheat meal or two. (don’t forget your cinnamon or lemon juice)
In my experience very few people arn’t able to make this work. Eating more protein will actually naturally keep you from over eating if any of that maybe going on.
Lastly get your blood work done and done again after 2-3 months after these changes and I bet you’ll be on your way!
Good luck. Please report back to the group.
Best,
Etienne
Thank you so much for your reply, Etienne. I will try upping the protein, fish oil, and get my bloodwork done and report back.
Hey Tim,
Just checking in-been doing the 4-Hour Body since end of Dec, best ski season ever and now best wakeboarding runs ever (I’ve only been able to go a few times this season so I don’t want to say “best season” yet). I am also very pleased that I am able to endure the cold pacific northwest waters much better than before and with less bodyfat thanks to “conditioning” with cold showers! I’ve spent my life (almost 49) being active and fit but the 4-Hour Body has taken everything to a new level. It’s amazing how a little bit of tweaking to diet and exercise can affect athletic performance and overall well-being. Now to work on my forearms so I can take my wakeboarding to the next level!
All the best,
Holly Morello
Holly,
Congrats, What amazing results! If you want gorilla-like upper body strength (without looking like a gorilla) then kettlebells are the way to go. You’re in the Seattle area aren’t you? Mssg me on FB if you’d like the name of my trainer. He goes everywhere from Seattle to Monroe and I highly recommend him.
Alison
Thanks for responding. I truly appreciate your posts and your willingness to offer suggestions. I do generally feel full after eating. Don’t feel like I’m starving myself or anything like that. Willing to eat more and experiment with more oil, just need some suggestions on how much to add. I take Carlson’s Cod Liver Oil 3 Tablespoons per day; mfg has the following per teaspoon: Omega 3 1100mg; DHA 500mg; EPA 400mg; ALA 40mg. If I currently weigh 272 at 33% body fat, how much oil should I target? And is that based on target body weight, current body weight, or lean muscle mass (272x.67)?
Eat more:
Should I increase the amount of beans/lentils and protein per meal? My fear here was after reading so many suggestions to others to cut down on beans. Should I throw in another shake? How much protein should I target? I’ve read the subtracting fat section, and I don’t see where there is a specific recommendation for certain amount of protein per pound of body weight. Might have missed it.
Also for KB swings, once I’ve hit 75 consecutive swings with 50lbs, should I increase the weight, or increase the number of swings?
I feel like I’m on the verge and if I could just get myself pointed in the right direction, the progress will start to kick in.
Hi, I had a baby 10 months ago and am still breastfeeding. I started doing the ice pack on the neck, and got my period within 3 days of doing this. Now of course this could have been a total fluke but I was wondering if ice on the neck does something to hormones that would bring on your period. Just to be clear I got my period once 3 months after having my baby and not again till now which is 10 months after birth. With my first child I didn’t get it back until his first birthday. I know this is slightly off topic but I am curious.
I was wondering if it’s okay to eat corn. It’s a vegetable, it’s not white but when it’s popped… And it’s rather sweet if eaten boiled (vs popped) so just thought I’d check.
Cheers,
Kora
Ashley,
Here are a few quick lunch/snack ideas:
-Beef jerky
-Cottage Cheese
-Hard Boiled Eggs (see below)
-Avocado (see below)
-Curried Lentil Stew (recipe: http://healthnutnation.com/2011/01/25/curried-lentils/). I make a big batch, then freeze in pint jars and take out as needed and warm up in microwave. (This would fulfill the bean and veggie requirements to go with that chicken breast)
– White bean chicken chili (recipe: http://allrecipes.com/recipe/white-bean-chicken-chili/detail.aspx). I changed this recipe up a bit to suit my tastes (I leave out the corn and don’t top with cheese or sour cream) but I have yet to publish my exact recipe so read the comments and change it to suit your tastes. I’ll eat this everyday for lunch when I make a batch.
…And then there’s Salad….
-Salad: Ingredients can be prepped in advance (Sunday is a great “prep” day) and grabbed each morning. Here’s what I prep:
Lettuce/greens: Wash lettuce and wrap it in a couple of paper towels and store in a plastic bag. When I am ready to use I take out what I want and rip it up. You can rip it up in advance but if you cut it up (using a knife) it will not last as long in the fridge and will get brown around the edges.
Mixed veggies: Wash and cut up peppers, peas, etc and place on a paper towel in a glass covered bowl.
Beans: I cook a cup of dried beans (black, lentil, etc), rinse, salt, and store in a glass covered container. Or, use canned- rinse and store the same way.
Meat: If you like chicken breast then pre-cook a batch of breasts (my favorite recipe that is moist and flavorful: http://healthnutnation.com/2011/08/09/incredible-grilled-garlic-chicken-breasts/ ), buy a rotisserie or use the pre-cooked breasts that are frozen. If you’re a steak or pork fan then pre-cook, slice, shred or leave whole.
Eggs: Hard boil a dozen eggs, peel at least 3- put on a paper towel in a glass container until ready to use. Slice and add to salad or eat a few plain instead of the chicken breast.
Avocado: Avocado’s are the ultimate take along snack food. Half an avocado (eaten alone) lasts me 2 hours. Keep a few on hand in your office fridge (once ripe they last a good week in the fridge, even when cut. Just keep the pit attached and put in a plastic bag to keep from browning). I love my salads with a quarter avocado sliced. They add a lovely creaminess to the dressing.
Nuts and seeds: I use various kinds as a topping on my salads. Sunflower seeds, sliced almonds, toasted cashews, etc. They add a nice crunch, a little extra protein and fat, and excellent flavor. 2 Tbs. goes a long way.
Dressing: Olive oil and balsamic are my favorite combination although I change it up sometimes and use toasted sesame oil and Sriracha sauce. Instead of balsamic I use a lighter vinegar like white balsamic or a flavored kind and drizzle with a different oil like Macadamia nut oil. Keep little bottles at the office. None of these needs to be refrigerated.
Salt and pepper: I learned this from my Italian in-laws. Salt and pepper add a lot of depth to a salad- bringing out the flavors and smoothing out any sharp edges (e.g. raw beet greens can be kind of bitter).
That’s it for now. I’d love to add to the list so tell me what I’ve missed!
Dear Tim,
My apologies if you have answered this before but I have been reading the book three times, watched all youtube videos and tried to read all comments here and didn’t find it.
What is the scientific reason behind eating the exact same meals over and over again?
Why not mix match every meal?
Thank you
Andy
Regarding fish oil, I thought I would pass this info along.
I discussed the quantity suggested in the books to a friend of mine who is an Oncologist and Hematologist. Fish oil acts like an anti-inflammatory a bit like Advil and high doses of fish oil will have an effect on blood platelets.
So be aware that after taking the high doses of fish oil suggested in the book, you will notice that you will bruise very quickly and quite heavily. Also do mention it to your doctor (or dentist) if you are going to have any surgery.
Tis true, Katherine is correct. (Altho the Inuit haven’t been reporting many cancers) Still correct. It maybe why it works. Safest protocol maybe high dose for 60 days, cut back 50% if you’re able to eat nothing but “clean” grass-fed meats/wild caught fish after that. And less still over time as you get leaner.
Of course if you’re morbidly obese as I was its a bloody freakin emergency. If you don’t believe me go ask your cardiologist.
I’ll cut back myself when I can see an ab (poke poke I can feel them so I know their in there somewhere:-)
I spent some time this afternoon looking through Tim’s book for any mention of Fish Oil. It’s not in the index under fish, oil, omega 3, supplements, or supplements he takes.
Does anyone else know where to find it in his book? I’m thinking there is nothing about fish oil.
I am not sure where the best place to post this little bit of info might be, but here goes. I was very interested in the notes about brazil nuts in The 4hrBody because I take selenium supplements to keep my TPO antibodies (anti-thyroid) down. Not uncommon for folks with autoimmune thyroid. When I read about the brazil nuts, I switched over, figuring that it was better to each food rather than supplements.. Then after 4 weeks, I had my antibodies tested, and much to my surprise, they jumped up by 30%, even though they had been holding steady for a little less than a year. So, I am switching back to supplements. Now, there has been one other big change during that time — doing the slow carb diet. But I am hoping the culprit is the brazil nuts.
Tim and Group,
I’m just beginning the PAGG stack and I picked up a bottle of Green Tea Extract in 750mg capsules. I then saw that it was only supposed to be 350mg capsules in the corrections. Based on the MAD, should I take one before breakfast and one before dinner, or should I take all three doses as recommended? I don’t expect any negative effects of taking 2250mg/day but I’m just curious.
Thanks in advance.
Great book Tim!
I recently found they had Kettle Bells at my gym, however, there is no way I can get to the gym do the training walk home and have breakfast (I hate, hate, hate protein shakes and have had the most abysmal luck with boiled eggs…don’t know if it’s the water or, what, but there is no way to peel them once cooked without ending up with half of it stuck to the shell and skin…yes, I tried baking soda, letting the water and egg reach the same temperature before cooking and several other suggested technics) within the recommended time limit. I can’t afford to buy any… my husband and I are building managers and are barely able make ends meet. Is it okay to do the workout with the Kettle Bells after breakfast or, later in the day? Any other suggestions, if that’s not possible?
Cathy,
Kettlebells are the greatest but don’t sweat when you do them. I do mine in the afternoon because that’s most convenient for me. Since, to me, they fall into the strength training category, I’m not concerned with doing them on an “empty” stomach. In fact, I take several BCAA tablets (or a small protein meal) prior to working out and then a recovery drink (carbs and more protein) post workout.
Very often I’ll have to split my workouts throughout the day and have found no loss of progress when doing so. I walk my dogs 20-25 minutes every morning followed by a 20-25 minute swim to start my day, and do KB circuits in the afternoon, usually before lunch. They only take 20-30 minutes for a good workout when interspersed with speed rope skipping.
So swing away anytime, and if you want more information on KB try “Enter the Kettlebells” by Pavel Tsatsouline (he’s the best source of KB information in my opinion.)
43 year old former athlete. in ok shape but finding waist is disappearing/ getting padded and love to get rid of it!
are jicamas ok on the slow carb diet? i can eat a whole one in the afternoon when tired and thirsty.
will give this diet the old college try. have to say the binge part is scary sounding but i’ll try anything for a month.
oh, and thoughts on edamame and tofu? thanks!
Hi Tim, just finished reading 4Hour Body and loved it. Will be attempting the slow carb diet and some of the exercises recommended for posterior. I am looking to lose about 10-15lbs but more importantly lower my bodyfat %. My question, silly as this may sound but once the results have been met does one stop the slow carb diet and reintroduce a little bit of dairy back and/or some fruit or is this way of eating for life. I could not find an answer to this. If you continue with this way of eating do you continue to burn fat?
Look forward to hearing from you. Onwards now to the 4 hour work week.
Regards,
Barb
I have just returned from a 9 day holiday having gained just 3 lbs. Considering a entertained binging every third day, I consider that a win!
Actually, that is not why I write this query. I started 4HB last April 6th at 186 lbs/29% body fat (tape). As of yet, I’ve never lost more than a few pounds and just before my trip I weighed in at 183 lbs. In June my caliper measurements showed my body fat reduced to 24.5%, and that is where I am today.
As for exercise, I do kettlebells a couple times a week and high intensity spinning twice. In addition, I’ll take several long walks during the week and I religiously stretch daily.
I apply ice packs on my neck/shoulder area nightly for about an hour and drink lots of iced water.
As for the diet, I am 99% catholic in following it. I enjoy cooking, unlike Tim, and constantly find new ways of creating interesting meals that fall within the regime. Initially I binged once a week, but have shifted to every 4 days in order to break the plateau. (I should mention that I’ve been on higher protein, low carb and glycemic eating for years and perhaps this is keeping me from losing weight.)
My frustration comes in two areas:
1. I really do want to weigh less (and understand the entire muscle mass-weight ratio) and still have muscles. Being stuck on this plateau is confounding!
2. Low energy is zapping me towards the end of the day. OK, so I’m approaching 60 and perhaps it is normal for many to doze off in front of the television…but that’s not for me. What to do?
Any insights or comments are appreciated. I’m back on the 4HB as of today and feeling good!
Hey Ron,
It sounds like you are doing a lot of things right and certainly must be pretty healthy, but you haven’t really told us what you eat with any specificity.
Give us some idea of the composition of your meals for a day or two including portion sizes. (maybe your meals don’t really fall with in the regime?
Perhaps eating a menu of food stuffs you can repeat nearly every day without quite the variety you enjoy for a test period to assure yourself better progress is the path before you branch out? Tell us more about your actual diet and someone will be able to weigh in.
My guess is there is no reason you can’t make the SCD work for you.
Best,
Etienne
Etionne
Just got extra incentive to get this weight off…my wife and I just introduced our 1st child to the world on 8/23/11. Gotta get healthy to be around for her!
Quick followup question on protein. You suggested I try upping the amount of protein and I’m trying to figure out the best way to go about doing that. From reading your posts, it sounds like with the exception of age (I’m 40) we have similar starting points and weight lifting/ fitness experience, but you’ve had significantly better results on the diet. I am at 272lbs today and average about 180g-200g of protein intake per day, assuming I have a no carb whey shake before bed. Currently I’ll have 1 8oz chicken breast or similar sized serving of beef or fish at each of 3 daily meals. So if you suggest dramatically increasing protein intake, eg. to move towards 1gm per lb, should I increase protein portion at each meal? I’ve tried eating 2 chicken breasts but its difficult to choke that down plus black beans and veggies. Is it ok to have a carb-free whey protein shake (56g of protein) before bed or is that counter productive? Again, looking for some guidance based on other’s experience to help me shape my experiment.
Hey Paul,
Important things first. Congratulations to you and your wife. A terrific reason to make even more progress to be sure.
I actually got a lot of ideas for tweaking the SCD from Tim’s excellent post on leaky gut syndrome and from Chris at athletic greens (I condensed part of what follows from an email of his) after I easily lost 20-25 pounds following SCD. (The cheat days just don’t work for my Stoic personality. I also cut out all beans and legumes also in order to force myself to really eat enough protein and still have room for my veggies.
Lastly unlike Tim I do not eat only grass fed beef or wild caught fish as much as I’d like to say that I do. I believe that in this case and for most of us generally high dose fish oil is important.
Pay close attention to the order of the steps as well as the simple steps themselves. This is worked for 5-6 of the dozen or so friends and family members of mine that actually follow it. SCD can be tweaked in other ways of course. Both have worked for me but this is exactly what I do.
1. Aim for a DAILY intake of 1 gram of protein per lb of bodyweight or more. Break this protein intake over each of your daily meals and make getting in that quota your priority at every meal. Eat your protein until you are about 75-80% of the way to satiety, check for fats, fill up on veges.
2. Fat SECOND. After you get your real food protein down, ensure you are getting some healthy, quality, FATS at every meal. (Fish oil is required in high doses and in pharmaceutical grade which is expensive although I found a pharmaceutical grade fish oil for only $18. a bottle
If you cook in coconut oil, limit omega 6 intake, eat little or no chicken and nothing for protein (careful whey protein consumption is okay) but grass fed meat, wild caught fish such as salmon, anchovies, and sardines, game meats and wild fowl, and vegetables, you are probably good to go without any supplementation other then half the recommended high dose of fish oil.
Everyone else needs to balance out their omega 3 to omega 6 ratios and reverse all the damage this imbalance has caused you, as fast as possible. You are aiming for a 1:1 to 1:3 ratio (you need a LOT more omega 3 and a lot LESS omega 6 to get this balance). We do this two ways. 1) LIMIT Omega 6 intake. 2) TOP up Omega 3 intake.
To top up Omega 3, do the following….
Take down a tablespoon or a handful of fish oil (liquid is much more convenient for me, pills when I travel only) with every meal. Work up to 10-50 GRAMS per DAY. (expensive quality fish oil in liquid form might cost $30-60 a month, although I found a <$20. brand vitacost)
Daily amount as follows:
50 grams if you are more than 30lbs overweight, any of your joints hurt, or you suffer any form of auto-immune or inflammatory disease. If you are anywhere in between, I recommend you continually build up towards 50 grams until you CAN see your abs, then drop back down to the 10 grams per day level.
Divide your daily intake across your meals equally.
Cook in coconut oil (low to high heat), or olive oil (low heat only), or in the animal's own fat (or rendered lard from grass-fed animals, if you can find it).
3. Veges THIRD. Yes, third. Fill up (keep going until you achieve satiety) with green, nutrient dense veges.
Just close out the meal and keep chomping until you are no longer hungry.
Limit fruit, eat NO carbs at all other than those naturally occurring in your vegetable selection, and only drink sugar-free, unsweetened beverages.
4. SUPPLEMENTS: Fish oil for Omega 3s and to combat inflammation, and Vitamin D3, ALA, NAC, Magnesium and Iodine
My "Don't Ever" list follows:
NO GLUTEN. Remember the "no anti-nutrients"? Gluten is the king of anti-nutrients. So that means not today, not on a cheat day, not once in the next 30 days, and ideally not ever. You are welcome.
NO GRAINS, NO CEREALS and NO LEGUMES. Sorry, they are OUT for my version of the fat loss cure. While legumes are by far a "lessor evil" when compared to gluten, the anti-nutrient content (lignans, lectin, saponins) plus the carb content rules them out. All cereals and all grains out means no quinoa, no oats, no brown rice.
NO JUICE. No juice….no juice. NOT ONCE.
NO DAIRY: including milk, cheese, whey protein, cottage cheese or anything else.
LIMIT FRUIT to post work out only, one serving or less (on average) per workout, until you are lean. Best choices are melons or berries. Limit means exactly that.
NOTES:
What about eating grain fed meat? Avoid it whenever budget and availability allow, those cows are unhealthy and have a messed up omega 3 to omega 6 ratio (omega 6 heavy, frequently higher than 1:20), but if you have to, go for the leanest cut you can (the fat on grain fed meat is BAD). PLUS automatic 10 grams of fish oil, every time.
Any meal that is made up of grass fed meat, wild salmon, anchovies, or sardines, you can halve the fish oil.
You do this for 30 to 60 days, then back fish oil down to 25 +/- grams per day
I eat a lot of egg whites, I do consume high quality whey protein powder and do NOT eat much chicken or fowl.
Lastly. Sleep. If you are not getting your sleep it is very hard to lose weight or even be healthy. (Tim's bit on sleep is great)
Good luck PLEASE follow up with any questions.
Best,
Etienne
Etienne
Your generosity and care in your responses makes me want to be a better citizen! I truly appreciate your input.
Thank you for your response. Question: How do you get sufficient fiber if you eliminate the beans? If I’m targeting @ 70g of protein per meal, eating enough broccoli to get me to 30g of fiber is going to be difficult. One of the things I liked about the beans is 9g of fiber per 1/2 cup serving.
Can you recommend a pharmaceutical grade liquid fish oil?
Finally,under your “don’t ever” list, you include whey protein, but then 4 paragraphs later you say you do consume high quality whey protein. Do you or do you not consume whey protein powder? If so which one, and if not, what do you use instead? (I can’t stand eggs or egg whites so they are not an option for me).
LOVE THIS LIFE CHANGE
I suffer from a skin disease called Tinea Versicolor. For the last 2 decades I’ve tried everything. Every doctor talked very little about changing my diet, but always perscribed another drug or cream. I’ve been doing the diet since July 18th. I started at 264, now at 249.
I noticed for the first time in almost twenty years my skin began to clear up. My neck and face looks clear again no more spots or blotches…..free at last
Wow mearsy that is fantastic!
Etienne,
Here are a standard day’s eating regimen:
Waking – ice water (500 ml)
3 brazil nuts
Prior to workout- whey protein shake 30 grams protein
2 T of either peanut butter or almond butter, natural
Post workout- 2 or 3 eggs, 1/3 cup of beans
Lunch- 4-5 oz of protein (fish, meat)
3-4 cups of salad
olive oil and balsamic vinegar
Snack – 2 T of peanut butter or whey protein shake
Dinner- 4-5 oz of fish, chicken or meat
zucchini or spinach, carrots – 1 cup total
6 oz of wine
Prior to bed- 3 brazil nuts
My basal is 1685, and I have tracked my caloric intake and come in under that.
I do 75 kettlebell reps twice a week using 35 lb weight, spend 45 minutes in HIIT spinning classes, 1 day for core exercises, and low/slow cardio for one hour.
As for my love of cooking, I cook low GI. For instance, tonight’s menu looked like this:
5-6 oz of swordfish with spices, basted in lemon juice and olive oil
1/2 cup cooked spinach with onions and crisped salami bits
3/4 cup of lentils
6 oz of white dry wine
Etienne, please share your thoughts.
Be well,
Ron
Hey Ron,
I’m really not too sure since you seem to have a nearly perfect (and very tasty) diet and certainly an intelligent work out plan. My suggestion is to get get rid of all the peanut butter and basically try cutting back on the beans and legumes and upping your protein intake a bit.
My answer to Paul’s question a few days ago (Still awaiting “Moderation” was a lengthy description of the 4 rules I follow and believe in. (I’m on a plan somewhere in-between SCD and Tim’s Last Mile Plan)
The following 4 steps serve to show how to eat in priority as well as what the contours of what I believe works best for me and a few people I know and have been able to influence. (Special Thanks to Chris @ Athletic Greens for his email from which this was adopted)
1. Aim for a DAILY intake of 1 gram of protein per lb of bodyweight or more. Break this protein intake over each of your daily meals and make getting in that quota your priority at every meal. Eat your protein until you are about 75-80% of the way to satiety, check for fats, fill up on veges.
2. Fat SECOND. After you get your real food protein down, ensure you are getting some healthy, quality, FATS at every meal.
If you cook in coconut oil, limit omega 6 intake, eat little or no chicken and nothing for protein (careful whey protein consumption is okay) but grass fed meat, wild caught fish such as salmon, anchovies, and sardines, game meats and wild fowl, and vegetables, you are probably good to go without any supplementation other then half the recommended high dose of fish oil.
You are aiming for a 1:1 to 1:3 ratio (you need a LOT more omega 3 and a lot LESS omega 6 to get this balance). We do this two ways. 1) LIMIT Omega 6 intake. 2) TOP up Omega 3 intake.
To top up Omega 3, do the following….
Take a tablespoon or a handful of fish oil (liquid is much more convenient for me, pills when I travel only) with every meal. Work up to 10-50 GRAMS per DAY. (expensive quality fish oil in liquid form might cost $30-60 a month, although I found a <$20. brand vitacost)
Daily amount as follows:
50 grams if you are more than 30lbs overweight, any of your joints hurt, or you suffer any form of auto-immune or inflammatory disease. If you are anywhere in between, I recommend you continually build up towards 50 grams until you CAN see your abs, then drop back down to the 10 grams per day level.
Divide your daily intake across your meals equally.
Cook in coconut oil (low to high heat), or olive oil (low heat only), or in the animal's own fat (or rendered lard from grass-fed animals, if you can find it).
3. Veges THIRD. Yes, third. Fill up (keep going until you achieve satiety) with green, nutrient dense veges.
Just close out the meal and keep chomping until you are no longer hungry.
Limit fruit, eat NO carbs at all other than those naturally occurring in your vegetable selection, and only drink sugar-free, unsweetened beverages.
4. SUPPLEMENTS: Fish oil for Omega 3s and to combat inflammation, and Vitamin D3, ALA, NAC, Magnesium and Iodine
Etienne,
I’ll take the coaching on the fish oil and peanut butter. I’ll continue to eat brazil nuts and cashews in moderation.
You didn’t mention anything regarding binge days, so currently I pig out (moderately) every 4th day. Any thoughts on this?
Thanks for your insights!
Danger Will Robinson! (Ron:-)
I would DEFINITELY not exceed Tim’s recommendation of 1 cheat day a week. You can try being less moderate on your single cheat day but do not cheat more then once a week.
I am certain you will enjoy much better results if you stick to Tim’s recommendations in this regard.
Good luck!
Etienne
Etienne,
Tim actually gave me that idea for additional binge days with the work he did with his father.
Thank you for the fat suggestions, what about butter? also where can i look for the “science” on fats? having debates with people about the health benefits of butter, oils etc vs margarine but am struggling for hard data. Please help, thanks
Hey Etienne,
I took your advice and cut out the beans and peanut butter. The first week I went from 186 lbs to 181. Second week back up to 184 and holding.
Now my daily diet protein intake is between 110 – 130g. I practice low glycemic eating anyway, and am riding that pony with good sized portions following Tim’s rule. I drink lots of water, possibly not enough, around 2500ml, and have cut out the wine. Every morning I have my psyllium and kimchee. Exercise routine is the same and binge about every 6 days.
I’m stuck and don’t know where to go with this? Your thoughts are welcome, of course.
What is ‘SCD’?
My husband and I have started the 4HB routine – for the last 2 weeks we have been doing the diet, exercises, binges and PAGG. I have some questions. Have posted a couple of times but no answers yet. Can someone help – please?
1 – RE PAGG – does anyone know why we have to take 1 day per week off and why it is CRITICAL to take one week off every 2 months? Just curious.
2 – Red wine is ok on the diet and anything goes on cheat day. What about vodka on the diet? It seems to me less sugar than wine – I don’t mix with fruit juice. Any ideas?
3 – Last – my husband brown bags it and eats on his go in the car. He is using protien bars to help supplement lunch. I sometimes have some too. I see it is ok in the body building part but what about weight loss? We use the high protien – low / no sugar varieties (Pure Protien and Think Thin). Also – my husband takes protien shakes. I see it is ok later but what about on the slow carb diet. He is losing weight but I want to get him onboard as much as possible. He takes whey protien that is lactose free.
Any help is appreciated.
Forgot in my last entry. We also bought the ice packs and do the ice therapy in the evening. Now we even look forward to it. Another 2 weeks and we see what measurements say. Any help on the questions would be a big help.
Thanks
Hey Paul,
Getting enough fiber without eating beans forces me to eat an awful lot of salad, with portions as big as my head once or twice a day. By using only fresh lemon juice, the finest olive oils and aged balsamic vinegar this becomes a real treat not a chore. It is a very nice counter balance for the pallet to any fat consumed in a meal.
Whey protein is (I think) a perfectly safe cheat from the purest approach of a 100% whole food diet. I justify the exception because I’d have difficulty eating nearly 219 grams of protein just from meat each day without it. (I would also have trouble getting my protein without relying on my cartons of egg whites I use for my morning omelet as well:-)
I think a fair compromise insofar as whey goes is to only eat full meals of which whey could be a component but not a replacement. (Tim’s #1 rule is “Don’t drink your meals”)
Furthermore I use whey protein shakes to include a bit of coconut milk for MCT (fats that your body processes like carbs) in my diet.
I might make a salad to go with a whey protein shake and take a shot of fish oil as a meal. (I try to never eat snacks per say. If I’m hungry I eat an unscheduled meal or increase portions sizes so that I am not hungry between meals. Filling up to 70% on your meat portion during mealtime tends to take care of this anyway)
I seem to have landed somewhere in between SCD and Tim’s Last Mile Diet. I could easily to go back to a pure SCD because it works REALLY well but I prefer forcing myself to eat a great variety of vegetables, living in California as I do.
Best,
Etienne
Try psillium for fiber. Mixed in a shake using a blender, it is pretty effective.
I just wanted to let you all know that I’ve updated my slow carb shake/smoothie recipe and have added a video so you can see how I make mine. (click on my name and you’ll see it on the front page (The 4 Hour Body Breakfast Smoothie).
Enjoy!
Thanks for the reply about the PAGG and letting the liver recover. I appreciate it….makes sense. I do take a couple of supplements from Costco and will be aware of China being the source. Good info. The rest I get from Life Extension and as for the PAGG I use the ones that Tim recommends so hopefully I am not getting too many unfriendly chemicals.
Do you know any information regarding the alcohol. While we aren’t big drinkers I sometimes have a vodka – usually with juice of 1 lime and selzer water. It would seem to me that this has less sugar than the red wine that Tim says is okay to drink daily. We don’t drink daily but occasionally would be nice.
Great job on the shake video. I may try it for my husband. I am not a fan of protien powder. I have a super sensitive sense of smell and cannot tolerate whey or egg white smells so I eat eggs in the am.
I am into week 4. I don’t have a ton to lose 10 – 12 would be nice 15 would be awesome. I lost 4 right away. Measurements this weekend – and I know there is change there. The scale will follow.
Thanks again for the info.
Karla,
Thanks for the kudos on the video! It’s funny, but I too have a gag reflux to the smell of eggs but the egg white protein doesn’t bother me. Either way, whey protein powder really isn’t a “whole” food and in some realms (Weston A. Price Foundation) considered quite unhealthy- so you’re not missing out. For me, it’s just a quick and easy way to get down 30 grams of protein. Pastured meat and whole eggs are truly a better choice.
Tim,
I’ve been doing some research on Tempeh and it seems to me that it would be a better choice than tofu for vegetarians on the SCD. It is cultured and fermented from whole soybeans and contains more protein than tofu. Because it is fermented it is more easily digested than tofu.
links to info on tempeh:
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Tempeh
http://www.pccnaturalmarkets.com/guides/tips_tempeh.html
Many tempeh’s on the market contain wheat or whole grains so it would be important to read the ingredients and look for pure tempeh.
Have you heard of any experimentation with tempeh or tried it yourself (maybe when you were doing the vegan thing)? Of course, I don’t believe it would be optimal (vs. animal protein), but possibly a better choice than tofu?
Let me know what you think so I can work on a recipe for your cookbook (inc. a vegetarian section???) that includes tempeh…
Hi Alison- I’m Charlie, Tim’s assistant. We’d love to see your recipes, as long as prep is under 20 minutes. Just submit them here: https://4hb.wufoo.com/forms/submit-your-tim-ferriss-diet-recipe
Also, from Tim: “Tempeh, without grain included, is better than tofu.” 🙂
Thanks very much for the response Charlie!
Karla G.
I think you’ll find answers to most of your questions if you read back through previous posts. There’s lots of good stuff in there!
Regarding taking time off from PAGG. As I understand it, taking time off from vitamins is important for your liver. Depending on the source of your vitamins (most are being sourced to China now- All vitamins from Trader Joe’s and Costco are sourced from China- I’ve asked) you’re probably getting some excess chemicals that are not friendly to the liver. In addition, you may be building up an excess vitamins and your liver needs a little break to thoroughly clean things out and get everything going in the right direction.
That being said, high quality vitamins, sourced from reliable companies are well worth the extra cost. Pharmaca carries good, high quality supplements and has a Naturopath, nutritionist, herbalist, and esthetician on staff to answer your questions. They’re a great resource if you have one in your area (they are online as well).
I am a little confused and cannot find any info on corn. Tim reccomends it in the book (in salsa) and I dont seem to find it on any “dont” lists however some have told me its a no no on slow carb. Please help settle the confusion. Thanks!
Hey Ron,
“Tim actually gave me that idea for additional binge days with the work he did with his father.”
His dad lost something like 95 lbs. so I’m not sure I have much ground to stand on if that is the case (Although I believe in this thread and the book he suggests only sticking to one)
I’m not comfortable with cheat days myself and so I maybe resisting the concept because where cheat do make sense is on a truly low carb diet, like the cyclical ketogenic diets many bodybuilders follow.
My own diet (being closer to Tim’s last mile is by my way of thinking probably also too high in carbs to benefit from a cheat day. If this is true and and I really don’t know that it is, SCD must certainly be too high in carbs to benefit from a cheat day.)
Now the “benefit” might be like in the case of my wife, who has done very well on straight SCD, could not stick to it without her special foods once a week.
The truth is I am really not certain on this point. I would stick to what Tim says If the science isn’t clear to me as to why that cheats on a moderately low carb diets like SCD work it could be because I haven’t really done my research.
Thanks for that tidbit though.
Best
Etienne
Karla G.,
I was reading The Paleo Solution by Robb Wolf last night (Tim had a guest post by Robb awhile back- Etienne has left a link to it on here a couple of times-thanks Etienne!) and came across an answer for you on pg. 138.
Essentially Robb says that drinking messes with your growth hormone release, which in turn messes with your sleep, which in turn causes you to not lose weight. Instead of staying away from alcohol altogether he recommends drinking it earlier- as far away from bedtime as possible.
Also, Robb isn’t a wine drinker himself, and like you (and me), prefers the hard stuff. Tequila is his preference and he drinks what he calls a “NorCal Margarita” which consists of:
2 shots Tequila gold
Juice of 1 lime
Splash of soda water.
Basically what you’re drinking only vodka instead of tequila. Robb goes on to state that there’s also “chemistry behind the recommendations. The lime juice blunts insulin release and the carbon dioxide bubbles in the soda water act as what’s call a “nonpolar solvent.” Which actually extracts the alcohol from the drink and delivers it to your system faster.”
Robb also suggests having some fat and protein a little later in the evening to get your blood sugar all squared away for the night (almond butter, a few nuts, a piece of beef jerky, or dinner).
Experiment and see what works for you. Clearly, if you find your weight loss stalls then lose the drink. Otherwise enjoy!
Hi Allison:
Thanks for the reply. I kind of figured it was ok but always want to ask. Don’t drink often but a cool one on the weekends is nice sometimes. Think I might have one tonight.
I appreciate your responses and your great recipes that you are posting. Great ideas! Keep it up!
I for one have stalled on the weight loss but I know I have put on good lean body mass. After 4 weeks I lost 5.5 inches and my husband lost 2.75 but gained 2.5 on his biceps which he was really happy about. I saw my doc yesterday and she says I look great and that my weight is ok for my height but the body recomposition was really important and really good. Starting to get Michelle Obama’s arms! Thanks Tim!
Hey Paul,
The best way to think about your question regarding if corn might be verboten is to think about where it and other foods fall on the Glycemic_index (You notice must of the foods you can eat feature lower numbers while the ones you cannot feature higher ones)
http://www.health.harvard.edu/newsweek/Glycemic_index_and_glycemic_load_for_100_foods.htm
“Glycemic index and glycemic load offer information about how foods affect blood sugar and insulin. The lower a food’s glycemic index or glycemic load, the less it affects blood sugar and insulin levels.”
Still plenty of great stuff you can put in a salad to go with your steak!:-)
Best,
Etienne
Hey Ron
Gourmets are dangerous people. Still I have to believe you are very close.
I still think your protein intake could use increasing.(keep in mind that eating your protein portion first until you’re 70% sated then eating your fill of vegetables will tend to crowd out unwanted extra calories. In other words eating enough protein, which comes packaged with fat will tend to fill you up and keep you from over feeding)
note on fiber: If you eat this way, Protein, with healthy fats first and vegetables until your full then psyllium or any supplementary fiber is totally unnecessary. It could be that your water intake isn’t high enough and psyllium holds about a million times its weight in water (not a scientific estimate) Your fiber intake if you eat nothing but protein packaged with fat followed by all the vegetables you can eat should be quite high.
Plan a test menu and try to stick to it for 30 days if you can. (before and after body-fat testing, even if only with a tape. Lose the scale for the most part) I would be very strict about cheat days, only once a week and then only after a normal SCD breakfast + lemon juice and cinnamon.
I would recommend trying the strictest possible diet along these principles as a test. Make sure your not going over your Brazil nut allocation.
After that if all goes well you can try and work in tweaks that might reflect how you like to eat.
Keep it up and you will get there.
Best,
Etienne
Etienne,
Gourmets, contrary to the belief of some, are not dangerous! We simply seek simple ways of adorning the bland with excitement. This doesn’t always mean heavy cream sauces and unhealthy additives! :>}
Question: Items on the domino list include garbanzo beans and hummus. I understand the latter since it contains tahini, a fat rich addition of ground sesame seeds. But why garbanzo beans?
Thanks for all you do for the community.
Ron
Hey Ron,
I come from a long line famous foodies myself:-)
My guess is at 269 calories per cup/serving they are nutritionally quite dense. Not a bad thing but added to everything else like nuts it is easy to over feed. (protein 1st, healthy fat 2nd, plant matter 3rd, then just a few calories spent on caloricaly dense foods like beans, legumes, nuts etc.)
Here is everything you’d always wanted to know about garbanzo beans but were afraid to ask. http://nutritiondata.self.com/facts/legumes-and-legume-products/4326/2
As always before adding an exception the best policy is to try and stick to Tim’s recommendations until you get things working, then you can branch out a bit.
Best,
Etienne
Etienne,
Since our last mutual entry, I now weight 178. Still must check body fat, but taking your advice seems to have knocked me off of the plateau on which I was stuck.
Be well,
Ron
I’m 300lbs and I started a FaceBook Event were i will attempt to lose 90lbs in 90 days using advice of the 4-Hour Body.
Tim better be right about his research because there are alot of eyeballs on it.
http://www.facebook.com/event.php?eid=151513691606646
Hey Luis,
Good for you. This SCD will work for you in long run. In the short term for your contest just be sure to be very strict, watch portion sizes and trigger foods like nuts and such. Maybe start off your cheat day with a SCD breakfast with the recommended lemon juice and cinnamon.
I bet you do it or feel real good about coming close.
Break a leg we are pulling for you.
Etienne
Thank you for the kudos.
I’m going to implement several other hacks. The FB event covers the public scrutiny one, the bet covers the competitive instinct one, i will use body space to keep up my measurements. I will also use hacks from the Damage Control on my free days, plus i will use PAGG and the torture baths.
People say i can’t do it, but Tim convinced me his research is good.
I just hope enough people take the bet so i can raise money for my first muse 🙂
Tuna is one of my favorite foods but with mercury levels being so high I’m just not willing to eat any old tuna. My brother lives in a tiny little fishing town on the Oregon coast and the tuna that the fishermen there catch contains the least amount of mercury of any tuna in the world.
It’s not cheap but it’s well worth the cost since it’s basically a grab and go meal that is SCD friendly. I order mine by the case. You’ll find links at the bottom of this article: http://healthnutnation.com/2011/09/15/alisons-favorite-back-to-school-foods-5-tuna/
Looking to start the diet this Monday (19th Sept 2011) but want to do it right and am happy to invest in it to get it right.
On that basis, has anyone actually found a bodymetrix handheld unit for £310 ($500), in the book it mentions that they are in development so I guess they are not on the market yet?
In the absence of a bodymetrix and the fact that I won’t have time to get to have my body fat measured professionally, has anyone got any recommendations or reviews on BEI scales.
Hi,
Could you please tell me if I can occasionally use chestnuts in place of beans? I can’t find anything definitive on this subject. (Specifically canned or frozen chestnuts with water and WITHOUT sugar.) Thank you, L
Hi there L,
If I’m not mistaken chestnuts are really a fruit, in which case they should only be consumed on your cheat day.
Best,
Etienne
Thanks. Though I would have preferred the answer to be different!
I haven’t seen that many (any) fat err obese people posting on the blog so I decided to share my story/experience on 4hb.
It’s day 36 and I am down 29.8 pounds.
My starting weight was 410 pounds. I am 6’3 and in my early 30’s. I began the slow carb diet in August on a Wednesday. I wanted my cheat day to fall on Saturday so I did not have my first cheat day until the 10th day of the SCD.
-Breakdown by Week
Staring Weight: 410 Pounds
WEEK ONE: 397.8 (loss of 12.2 pounds)
WEEK TWO: 394.6 (loss of 3.2 pounds)
WEEK THREE: 387.8 (loss of 6.8 pounds)
WEEK FOUR: 384 (loss of 3.8 pounds)
WEEK FIVE: 380.2 (loss of 3.8 pounds)
TOTAL LOSS: 29.8 pounds
-What I Eat:
I have followed the diet Sunday-Friday by the book. Only had one non-compliant meal so far (baked beans in a thick barbecue-ish sauce and chicken breast and thighs with skin for lunch). My staple meal is Ground Beef (trader joes 80/20 fat) with spinach, onions, and beans. Black beans and Pinto beans are the ones I’ve eaten the most. I finally found tasty non-soup canned lentils (Whole Foods) so I will be incorporating them. I also sometimes order a “steak” plate with beans and guacamole at my local burrito/Mexican food place. The “Chipotle Bowl” has also been pretty helpful (no rice or cheese).
I have been eating a spinach omelet with beans every day religiously within an hour of waking up. This is probably the hardest part to change because its such a heavy meal so early in the morning. I just force myself to eat as much as I can. I started with three organic eggs first two weeks the went down to 2. I am going to go back to 3 just to make sure I am getting enough protein.
-Don’t Weigh Yourself Everyday:
My weight fluctuates a lot especially right after cheat day. I’ve gained up to 7 pounds after a binge day and usually lose all the excess weight by Wednesday. I’ve noticed that the best indicator for me is weighing myself PRE binge on Saturday.
For example two Saturdays ago I weighed in at 385.6 pounds. Last Saturday (a week after) I weighed in at 380.8 pounds. A loss of almost 5 pounds.
-Thoughts So Far
I have found the SCD (thanks to the cheat day) fairly easy to follow. Every time I get a craving I write it down and keep a list for Saturday. I have not felt hungry at all. The only time was on a meal in which I skipped the beans. I have not been exercising much. I do 30 mins of cardio maybe 3-4 times a week at the gym and Tim’s crunches (x10). I am not doing the supplements (other than a multi-vitamin a day). I feel great so far. A lot more energy and clarity.
Any feedback would be appreciated. Especially if you see any glaring mistakes as to the diet. I do have some questions: I am not really eating organic beef, is it really that important? Also how long should the cheat days last? I have been doing them for 12 hours can I go up to 18-24?
Wow!! Thanks for sharing your success with us!
Marcel-
First of all,YOU ROCK! The slow carb diet (SCD) is totally working for you so I personally wouldn’t worry if I were doing anything “wrong.”
You asked about organic beef:
The difference between organic beef and regular beef is that the cows are fed organic, non-GMO (genetically modified) grain versus regular old grain (most of which has been genetically modified and sprayed with plenty of pesticides).
The problem with both conventional and organic beef is that the cows are still being fed grain. Cows are meant to eat grass, not grain, and it makes them sick. That’s why Tim (and I) recommend grass fed beef. Because the cows are fed a species appropriate diet -grass- which is what keeps them out of the Dr.’s office.
In addition, the fat that grass fed cows produce healthy fat- Omega-3 (like you get from salmon). Conventional and organic beef contains very few Omega-3’s and a disproportionate amount of unhealthy fats (Omega-6- healthy in the right dose,very unhealthy when there’s too much of it).
Of course, like the cow, we are what we eat. If we eat sickly cows that have been fattened just as quickly as possible, fed antibiotics on a daily basis, and factory-farmed the hell out of, then we shouldn’t act surprised when we in turn feel the effects of what we’ve eaten.
Now, all of that being said. Budgets are tight and buying expensive grass fed meat, or affording and storing a side of beef may be cost prohibitive. However, if you take into account what you may be spending on Dr. bills, medication, supplements, etc. you may determine that that grass fed beef ain’t so pricey after all.
Marcel, once again, thanks for sharing. Keep it up and keep us posted!
William and Alison thank you for your comments.
Alison I had no idea you could get Omega-3 healthy fat from cows. I thought it was exclusively from fish, I’ll definitely look into incorporating grass-fed meat into my diet.
Marcel,
Congratulations, your success encourages the rest of us.
Thank you for sharing and continued success.
I wonder if anyone else has tried to incorporate the Shangri-la diet (using flavorless oil to suppress appetite) along with the 4HB? I have and I am not sure how well it’s going. Background: I am 41 and a mother of two little beauties. I bike, walk, and do yoga and eat mostly organic food and (other than my phat sweet-tooth) am naturally drawn to healthy foods. I’ve been on the 4HB diet (along with the Shangri-la diet) two months and I’ve lost about 8 pounds. I feel very grateful for that since I lost not a single pound last year doing weight watchers. I followed weight watchers for two years after having my last child and, though I lost 30 pounds in the first year, I could not–and I worked really hard–get beyond 160 during the second year. And I was working way too hard to just maintain my weight. When I first tried the Shangri-la diet’s dose of flavorless oils I experienced a release from hunger that was completely amazing. It was not a hunger suppressant but something else entirely–like a magic pill. Like an addict who suddenly found herself released from all compulsion. It was delightful. I thought it was the dawn of a new day but it didn’t last — or I haven’t been able to figure it out yet. I wish I could maintain that release from the grip of food; from the obsession to eat more than I need. So I wonder if the flavorless oils have worked well (or not) for anyone else on 4HB? I wonder if it’s related that I have found it hard to eat enough because I have no desire for my beans and protein (very odd for me since I’ve always had a great appetite and strong stomach) and yet I often get really hungry. I think that perhaps the oils make me unable to eat much (have low appetite) but for whatever reason don’t keep me from experiencing a good deal of hunger. That’s fine since I’m used to suffering when it comes to diet. But I do find it confusing and am working to figure it out. Also, I get so full on cheat day that all I end up eating is one big meal and then I’m stuffed for the day and all I can stomach is ice cream. I’m in this very odd situation: I don’t enjoy eating during the week (and I have always loved to eat–even on weight watchers) and I don’t really enjoy the full-on gorging of cheat day (which is weird because I thought I would eat all day with great relish). So I am going to stop doing the oils and see if anything improves. I do want to enjoy food and wonder if the oils have interrupted that? And, changing subject, following 4HB has been about more than me and my body: it’s really changed the way I think about this as a larger social issue. Dr. Seth Roberts’ description of the science behind tricking the hypothalamus and reading Tim Ferris’ wonderful book, I realize–quite acutely–how little we understand diet and weight loss. It is astonishing that we are completely ineffective in the face of such a wide spread but seemingly simple health problem — dieters have a 2% success rate for long term weight loss maintenance. I mean it shouldn’t be so hard to follow the doctor’s advice and eat a bit less and exercise more. But I bet it’d be easier to climb Mount Everest. Dieting is one of the most difficult, mind-numbing, and emotionally exhausting endeavours I’ve ever engaged in…and I have a PhD. Writing a dissertation was child’s play next to maintaining weight loss. I work really hard keeping my weight down and I have something — but not THAT much–to show for it. Thanks to Ferris for his hard work trying to reveal these mechanisms in a way that’s so open, creative, and collaborative.
Hey Paola,
I think that what you seemed to have decided is the right way to start. That is to stick to straight SCD.
While you can cut back on or even skip the beans you cannot skimp on your protein or this diet will not work. I would try and build each meal around a protein source, eat that until you are 70%+ full before moving on to your veggies. (Keep an eye on bean portion sizes, nuts even more so.)
Eating enough protein will make sure that you are always satisfied and do not over eat.
If you can’t eat all grass feed meats and wild caught fish then supplement with high dose fish oil.
Try and stick to the program strictly for 30, 60 days and you will be amazed.
Good luck.
Etienne
Tim any thoughts on Juice Plus? Am combining with PAGG – its pretty good stuff, although popping 21 pills a day seems like a lot when you combine the JP with PAGG.
Love your book Tim – just got turned onto it by my husband. We are both trying the diet but are also going to supplement with whey protein. I have used a few different kinds of organic ones. Any opinion on a good one for women?
Thanks
Just wondering if anyone has any supplement suggestions besides the policosanol for high cholesterol. My husband and I both have it running in the family – no diet related at all. My husband’s is off the richter scale and triglycerides unbelievable! I have had high LDL since about 18 but really high HDL and great triglycerides. My doctor wants to put me on meds which is not happening. I explained that I have started policosanol and CO Q10. Also a lipid control supplement that is from Life Extension. My husband won’t take the lipid control but takes the other 2. He can’t take statins or red yeast rice (allergic). My numbers are awesome compared to his but my doc wants my LDL down about 28 points (not way too much).
We have also found out I have hypothyroidism and I just got medication for that. He said it won’t affect lipid levels. He understands that it is not diet or exercise related (as he can see by all of my other levels) – but he is giving me 2 – 3 months then redo the blood panel. Hopefully these take hold by then but other suggestions would be appreciated – especially for my husband.
Thanks
Hey Karla,
This is serious stuff and I am not going to suggest a natural alternative to what what your doctor recommends. I am not a medical doctor myself and I have to trust that you and your husband are receiving good care.
Having said that there are changes you can make to your diet that_will help.
Fish and omega-3 fatty acids (fish oil)
The highest levels of omega-3 fatty acids are in:
Mackerel
Lake trout
Herring
Sardines
Albacore tuna
Salmon
Halibut
Walnuts, almonds and other nuts
Walnuts, almonds and other nuts can reduce blood cholesterol. Rich in polyunsaturated fatty acids, walnuts also help keep blood vessels healthy.
All nuts are high in calories, so a handful will do. To avoid eating too many nuts and gaining weight, replace foods high in saturated fat with nuts. For example, instead of using cheese, meat or croutons in your salad, add a handful of walnuts or almonds.
Olive Oil can help lower your LDL and raise your HDL levels.
A careful slow carb diet featuring lots of fish and a few nuts and healthy oils should really help. I don’t think it is necessarily something to replace your doctors advice rather something that you can do in addition.
Good luck.
Best
Etienne
Hi Etienne:
Thanks for the input. Yes – I am really concerned for my husband especially. Mine is not so bad – REALLY high HDL and REALLY low triglycerides only mildly high LDL. My husband – high on everything….alarmingly so. We are following advice of his cardiologist. Basically already do all of the food choices that you have suggested and anything red that we eat is grass fed only. I just thought maybe there were some supplements to add since he can’t take statins or red yeast rice.
I really appreciate your input. You always have a lot of great info for people. As an FYI – weight isn’t changing much (but I don’t have much to lose) but inches! We won’t be in town next week so we took measurements today. So we have done 4 week ones and now 3 week ones. I am down 12.25 inches and my husband 6.55! Amazing!
Thanks again and keep low carbing!
Karla
Karla,
In the case of your husband I would go out on a limb and say if it were me, not necessarily advice I could support with conclusive human study data mind you, I would try 60 days of very high dose pharmaceutical grade fish oil, proceeded and followed by blood panels.
10 grams per day minimum 20 grams even better. You can always move down to more moderate doses over time, insofar as future blood panels support it.
The recommendations assume that you are taking pharmaceutical grade fish oil. This is a highly refined product which has had many of the pollutants and impurities removed and has a much higher concentration of Omega-3 fats. They are however very expensive.
You can get away with less refined fish oils. Look for ones where EPA and DHA levels when added together are around 50% of the total amount of oil.
e.g.
Each capsule contains:
Fish Oil 1000mg
which contains:
EPA 300mg
DHA 200mg
300mg + 200mg = 500mg which is half of the 1000mg of total fish oil.
Then you need to put some of the fish oil into the freezer overnight. In the morning cut open the capsules and if the oil hasn’t frozen, then you’re onto a winner. If the oil/liquid is frozen solid – do not use that fish oil!!!
How Many Fish Oil Capsules Should I Take?
Then you need to workout how many capsule to take in a day. To do this add together the EPA and DHA figures (these are the Omega-3 fats) – in the example above this comes to 500mg. As an example, if we wanna be taking 20 grams (20,000mg) of Omega-3 per day, then if we’re using the above brand we need to take 40 capsules. (This is where premium quality capsules or liquid fish oil starts to make sense. Followed by a fresh lemon juice chaser it isn’t bad)
From personal experience, fish oil is magic – but you need to make sure that you take the right doseage and that you take high-enough quality oil.
Good luck!
Etienne
Wow! Thanks for such complete information. Fish Oil 101. I joke but seriously… I really appreciate the information. I agree with you that fish oil is a miracle. I was aware of the pharmaceutical grade vs not and we do use a pharmaceutical grade supplement. It is expensive but you get what you pay for. My husband takes a double dose but I am going to see if I can get him to take more. Capsules are my only choice – he will not consider the oil itself. I – have a problem with the oil “repeating” on me. Have tried freezing the capsules, take with food, etc. Have settled on a brand that has orange oil in it. So – if I have a problem…..orange (fishy orange) still not the best but not gagging.
He is beginning to take this a bit more seriously and has agreed to see a cardiologist in our area (that he saw before) that is in integrative medicine and attached to a holistic pharmacy. They do incredible things with natural supplements (which in all honesty are still drugs-right?). Everything we take in is a drug to our body…but I won’t bring that up to him.
Again….I appreciate you sharing your information. As they say – information is knowledge and I am a sponge. I try to learn all I can.
Keep up your great work and the information sharing….awesome.
Respects,
Karla
Take 2000mb of Red Rice Yeast with 100 mg of CoQ10. It has lowered my cholesterol from 235 to 125 with a ratio of 3. Triglycerides are down, too.
Best place to purchase I found is COSTCO.
Karla,
High cholesterol has been vilified in our nation. However, there is a camp out there (known as the Weston A. Price Foundation) that believes that high cholesterol and heart attacks are not necessarily related. In fact the WPF foundation believes that cholesterol plays a vital role in our health. Going so far as to state “For men and women of all ages, high cholesterol is associated with a longer lifespan.” WPF says that a person is more at risk of developing heart disease if they are a smoker, obese, eat a lot of processed foods and conventionally raised animal proteins, and/or have a lot of stress.
Gary Taubes touches on cholesterol as well in his book Good Calories, Bad Calories. In it he talks of the plight of President Eisenhower who suffered a heart attack and almost went mad trying to cut cholesterol in the form of animal fat out of his diet. Eisenhower’s frustration was because his numbers only got worse when he cut out the animal fat. In the end Eisenhower was never able to lower his cholesterol levels and died of heart disease. It was likely not the cholesterol, but the stress that truly left its mark.
Resources:
The Cholesterol Myths by Uffe Ravnskov, MD, PhD
http://www.ravnskov.nu/cholesterol.htm
Weston A. Price Foundation
http://www.westonaprice.org/cardiovascular-disease
*To any Negative Nancy’s out there just waiting to pounce please note that I am not giving my opinion one way or the other. I am providing information/resources so that Karla can make up her own mind.
But isn’t cholesterol bad for you?
“This belief is predicated on the Lipid Hypothesis of cardiac health (cholesterol = bad), which I disagree with based on the sum total of available evidence.” Timothy Ferriss pg. 262 The 4 Hour Body
While it be a case of the Paradox of Authority, and is certainly a minority opinion I for one, agree with Tim and Alison.
Best,
Etienne
Etienne,
Actually the history of cholesterol scare goes back a few decades when the pharmaceutical companies were looking where to focus their efforts. They had a choice between cholesterol and MS ( if my memory serves me). Anyway, they thought a greater opportunity was the former, so they fired up the engine and gave us what we have today.
In fact, there was little known about cholesterol for many years. Today, researchers know there are numerous factors and even other elements making up the overall cholesterol story. Regulating HDL and LDL was a gross attempt founded in profits. To get a well researched read: http://www.menshealth.com/health/understanding-cholesterol-and-heart-disease
Be well,
Ron
Hi there!!!
A quick question (but it’s highly important to get an answer here):
What happens AFTER the SC Diet? What if someone reaches their goal weight and shape? What’s the after day like?
Thanks in advance.
Naja
Naja,
This is primarily a forum for people on the Slow Carb Diet. I am happy that whatever diet you believe to be similar but superior is working for you, rhetorical questions aside.
Good luck indeed.
Etienne
I LOVE this book and have given about 5 to friends so far!!
My question is about the ice water/breakfast right after waking thing: sometimes (read: 3-4/week) I wake up at some ungodly hour to go to the bathroom and then have a hard time falling back to sleep, sometimes staying awake for two hours or more, so I’ve taken to having a protein shake at that point and going back to sleep. Is that ok, or is this as bad as eating right before bedtime?? Then when I wake up a couple hours later does the “eat within 30 minutes” thing still apply? Or is Tim talking about waking from REM sleep? I’m just beginning my 4th week, but I’ve lost about 8 total inches and I’m really liking the plan, just could use a bit of advice on this. Thanks!
Hello all,
48 year old mother of two here.
Way back in February I started the SCD and lost 5kg in about 8 weeks, as well as quite a few centimetres, which was great, but since then I have continued SCD and I absolutely cannot get the scales or the tape measure to move.
I still have 5kg to go to de-composition the obvious body fat and this lack of progress has been extremely frustrating. Luckily the SCD is not hard, and I have totally adopted it and can stick with it, but why won’t the other 5kg or so go??
I have been doing the ab and kettlebell routine all along, and 6 weeks ago started with a kettlebell trainer on a 3 week course to try to up the cardio aspect. No change. The trainer suggested I should actually add food to the SCD (we roughly worked out my daily intake was about 1100 -1200 calories) as she thought my body had acclimatised to it.
I’ve spent the last 3 weeks on holiday in the US so used that opportunity to up the food intake – e.g. by having sandwiches for lunch, bread with dinner, dessert a couple of times a week. I came back exactly the same weight as when I left. True, we did alot of walking and sightseeing but that hardly burns any calories.
I read the Last Mile chapter and I don’t see that as a solution. It’s a short term extreme approach to losing body fat temporarily and it’s not sustainable.
What I need is to get this last 5kg off permanently – what can I do??
All thoughts and suggestions welcome.
Hi Skippy,
Congrats on your progress to date. I’m a 49 yr. old mom of 3 and can relate. I started the SCD/4HB at the end of December. I never had much to lose, but after some initial loss (which took about 5 weeks to kick in), I progressed by not significantly until the end of the summer. I had a disaster in my kitchen and consequently had to grill everything for about 6 weeks. This meant I cut back on the amount of healthy oils that I normally used to saute in and the balsamic vinegar I use for seasoning. I mostly ate wild Alaskan salmon, raw veggies (mostly yellow & orange bell peppers), & about 1/2 cup black beans per day. I started my day with a ready made protein shake from Genuine Health. I had already stopped consuming almonds and avocados and cut my wine consumption back to just a few nights a week, rather than nightly. The only sweetener I have been using is the little bit that is in the protein shake. I just use cinnamon in my morning coffee. A few times a week I may indulge in a little dark chocolate and when berries were in season in my area, I ate them. My workouts now consist of 2 weight sessions per week. I use as heavy as I can lift and lift to failure much like the GTF workout. I take the PAGG supplements as well as fish oil among other things. I eat protein (a salmon patty, hard boiled egg, or some turkey lunch meat) and/or veggies when I am hungry. I also don’t eat as many meals as I did in the beginning. I do the cheat day but don’t go wild, I just have normal meals but non-SCD foods that I love, like pizza (however, now I have to take a digestive enzyme to enjoy it!). I think things are a little different for us women in the perimenopause/menopausal period and we too have to “body hack” to find what works. Good luck! I hope this helps!
Hi Skippy, pdxHollym gave you great advice. Keep your protein intake_way up. (1 gram for every 10 lbs of body-weight. Really) Watch the almonds, and other trigger foods.
Its easy to go off the rails but even easier to get back on. SCD will likely work for you if you just tinker around with it a bit.
Best
Etienne
Etienne,
I want to thank you for all of your very helpful posts you have done wonders for my tweaking of the scd. In one previous post you said in regards to bacon:
“Its not the fat in bacon per say that I would worry about, rather the omega 6 / omega 3 ratio here are the totals for 28 grams of bacon:
Total Omega-3 fatty acids 59.6mg | Total Omega-6 fatty acids1259mg + salt
In reading those ratios I would not know how to determine if it is a good total or bad. What are the implications of such numbers and where can I get a little more knowledge on the omega 6/3 numbers and their meanings. btw thanks for the link to nutritional values of foods! take care
Paul
Etienne,
I am sorry i posted a question on omega’s etc without thoroughly reading the page. I dont know how to remove a post (can i switch my question to this?) but received my answer from one of your previous posts. Thanks again to Etienne and all who help out with great stories, sample meals and advice.
take care all
Hello, everyone!
Yesterday, I posted a question about what the day after would look like once we reach our goals. What’s the advice on that, huh?
Anybody there????
Naja,
Once you reach your goal, first, celebrate BIG, after that, however, you’ll likely need to stay on the SCD to maintain it. The SCD is really a lifestyle change. Some people experiment with adding back cheese and/or sweet potatoes, rice, etc. and maybe an additional cheat day. It’s all about your own body and what works for you. If you are new to the SCD, you will likely realize that you feel so much better eating that way and will be motivated to just stick with it for life. Good luck!
Thank you so much pdxHollym!
After reading your answer (as well as the book) I can’t help thinking about the numerous similarities that SCD presents when compared to Pierre Dukan’s Diet that I’m on for 1,5 months now (Second Phase-Cruise-with striking results).
The only difference I’ve noticed (especially judging from the posts in here) is that SCD followers have a lot more cravings that we do on the other side of the Atlantic. I think Pierre Dukan really educates you on how to eat afterwards in a really failure proof and balanced way. But at least I can use Tim’s useful tricks for this second phase of Dukan’s Diet and I really thank him for that…
Good luck to all of us!!!
Naja
Hi guys, I wrote in the other day about what to do if you wake in the night and do not fall back to sleep for a few hours, what’s the protocol? I would really love some insight from you guys. I’ve copied the original post for ease.
I’m 37, 43%bf, 5’8″ been on SCD for just 3.5 weeks and I’m down 9+ inches, and 3% bf. This week, I’ve added PAGG and the 3 exercises Tracy did 3 times a week.
ORIGINAL POST——-
My question is about the ice water/breakfast right after waking thing: sometimes (read: 3-4/week) I wake up at some ungodly hour to go to the bathroom and then have a hard time falling back to sleep, sometimes staying awake for two hours or more, so I’ve taken to having a protein shake at that point and going back to sleep. Is that ok, or is this as bad as eating right before bedtime?? Then when I wake up a couple hours later does the “eat within 30 minutes” thing still apply? Or is Tim talking about waking from REM sleep? Thanks!
Hey Elle,
I wasn’t completely sure which is why I didn’t answer but I’d yes and yes!
Its working for you so don’t stop now.
Best,
Etienne
Elle,
I have a feeling that “waking up at some ungodly” hour is not exactly working for you. Unless you are able to make up for that missed sleep by sleeping in or napping later in the day it’s likely just missed sleep. Which is not a good thing.
Also, eating during that time is reinforcing to both your body and brain that it is “time to be awake.” I know personally that if I get up to have a drink of water, let’s say because I’m sick and my throat is sore. After a week of getting up for a drink it will have become a habit. I’ll find myself waking up thirsty even though I’ve no longer got a sore throat.
If you are hungry at let’s say 3:00 am then that means you are not eating enough during the day. Take Tim’s advice and have a spoonful of almond butter before bed. Or, eat a larger dinner, or even a later dinner.
My guess as to what is really going on with you is that your cortisol levels are messed up. Are you tired during the day and then when it’s time to go to bed awake and full of energy? Do you wake up at the same time every night- say 3:34 AM and then have a hard time going back to sleep? Cortisol levels should be high in the morning and drop steadily as we get closer to going to bed.
If the above described scenario sounds familiar then you need to have your cortisol levels checked (a full neurotransmitter panel would be most helpful- best done by a Naturopath who knows how to read the results and what to do when levels are askew). You can read more about sleep and how important it is in Robb Wolfs book The Paleo Solution.
Losing weight and getting your insulin levels under control are a great start. Getting a good solid nights sleep should only help the weight come off faster and you feel better.
Alison
Hi Paul,
Thanks for the kind words. Never-mind bacon per say for right now the real culprit is bad fats from commercially raised meat on the hoof, poultry (any kind) and unhealthy oils.
You know that SCD eliminates grains and many unhealthy oils which are high in omega 6 but low in omega 3. Well commercially raised meats are fed grains and have similarly out of balance omega 6 to 3 ratios. This is thought to cause oxidation or swelling and so it is that SCD is both low glysemic (sugar) and feature low inflammation factor foods.
By way of example “Confinement pork lard has similar OMEGA 6:3 ratios to feedlot beef with a 100gm serving containing about 8 grams of Omega-6 and 0.8 grams of Omega-3. That works out to a ratio of 10 to 1!”
You can read about pastured pork here, (like grass fed beef)
http://whitmorefarm.blogspot.com/2010/04/lard-love-story.html
This is what some people mean when they say it is better to eat clean food. It is why I take oil dose fish oil when I am not able to always eat grass fed beef, or wild caught fish.
Hope this helps a bit.
Best,
Etienne
Etienne,
Thanks a bunch now just a follow questions about oil. I have been using the following for stove top cooking, mostly frying/sauting etc
grass fed butter (all temperatures)
olive oil (low temp)
macadamia nut (high heat)
grapeseed (high heat)
coconut oil (high heat)
Am I on the right track? Also I noticed in the ingredients list of athletic greens there are fruit products. Is this not going to have the negative effects on weightloss that eating fruit has?
Paul
Paul,
You are very nearly perfect. Absolutely lose the grape-seed oil though (http://nutritiondata.self.com/facts/fats-and-oils/579/2) go light on the olive oil fine for salads etc. Make coconut oil your main oil for frying. (It has the added benefit of MCTs a fat your body thinks is a carb. It also mixes very well with grass-fed butter 3 parts coconut oil + 1 part butter)
Absolutely do not worry about any of the dried fruit ingredients in Athletic Greens (they also offer a fine new fish oil supplement I use BTW)
Sounds like you are right on target otherwise.
Best
Etienne
Update and Questions:
Posted about three weeks ago. It’s Day 57 of the SCD and I am down 43.6 pounds. Started at 410 down to 366.4 pounds.
The only change I’ve made is replacing my ground beef meal with chicken (frozen thighs) and 3 (instead of 2) whole organic eggs for breakfast (+spinach/onions/lentils).
I have been doing 30 mins of cardio and 10 reps of crunches M-F at my local gym.
I am almost at the 2 month mark and I am thinking about adding more intense exercises (as in free weights etc.).
1. Ive read some materials on the internets that exercise can be counter productive to the SCD, does anyone have any thoughts on this?
2. Has anyone had success with the kettlebell?
Hey Marcel,
Free weights are ideal for optimum results and kettle-bells are an excellent way to get started, kettle ball swings a great all around exercise in particular.
In your case, as in my mine I’d worry about injury prevention. The section pre-hab starting on pg 324 of The 4-Hour Body is a must read. (Tim said it was the hardest section to write) Really do yourself a favor and put yourself through it. It will be easier with a personal trainer but is doable on your own with a little care.
Good luck.
Best
Etienne
Thanks Etienne,
I’ve looked and looked, but haven’t seen anyone else ask the same question. I appreciate your feedback! I’ll report my findings. 🙂
Hi Alison! Thanks for your input. I’m waking up at around 4am-ish to go to the bathroom, not because I can’t sleep. I fall asleep just fine around 11 or 12, and prefer to wake up at 6-7 and start immediately. The middle of the night thing is really like 2-3 times a week and I didn’t want to just lay there because eating breakfast at 4:30 just isnt palatable to me. I’ll look into the test you mentioned though, it couldn’t hurt to have more info!
Thanks again.
It seems from Tim’s words that he uses Athletic Greens only on cheat days. Is this correct? Thanks for help with this clarification
Etienne,
I understand that summer squash is suitable for SCD, but what about winter squash like turban or butter? On other diets, winter squash are generally tossed in with potatoes and root vegetables.
Be well,
Ron
Hey Ron,
Don’t know about other diets, or why they say what they say but the nutritional profile http://nutritiondata.self.com/facts/vegetables-and-vegetable-products/2644/2 of winter squash would seem to be fine. Especially even you know you are still getting enough protein and healthy fats.
Best,
Etienne
Hi Etienne,
This opens a whole new world of SCD gourmet options! ;>}
So, how to stop this habit of staying up late (after midnight), listening to music in YouTube videos (listening to Dido at the moment), reading interesting websites such as this one, munching to go along with my beer.
I wouldn’t eat conventional dairy products even on a cheat day in this day and age. To much crap in it.
I’ve been on 4HB SCD since January with only 1 month off when I got a GI infection that left me unable to eat solid food for that time.
Overall I’d say its been working well. I’m down 33 lbs with about 15 or so to go. (I’m 5′ 3″ F and 37 years old.)
When I follow it perfectly I get great results, if I follow it 95% I get okay results, if I follow it 90%, I get 0 results.
If anyone is wondering whether to follow the plan or wander off, just make sure you don’t wander too far and that you are willing to accept the consequences (positive and negative) of your decisions.
Hi all,
Not quite sure if this post is still being watched but I’ll give it a shot.
I was wondering if anyone had any success finding out about thyroidectomies + the ‘cheat day’ metabolic resetting/ calorie cycling etc. of the slow-carb diet. I noticed a few people asking something like this over the page.
I had a thyroidectomy about seven years ago (22 now) and whilst the day-to-diet seems right up my alley (although I only want to lose about 8-9lbs), I’m doubting my body’s ability to ‘process’ and ‘learn’ from a binge day in terms of resetting metabolism seeing as though I’m thyroid-free (obviously taking synthetic thyroxine).
Would I just be better off having a calorie controlled day-off that includes a broader range of food, just for the stickability factor?
Does anyone with no thyroid have any experience with the diet they can share?
Thanksgiving is coming up and my normal cheat day is Sunday – is it ok to switch it to Thursday for just one week? That would mean going only 3 days between cheat days on one end and then 9 on the other end. (instead of 6 and 6). Will this affect my results?
Hey Joan,
The amount of food consumed at Thanksgiving will affect your result more then your cheat days being momentarily out of sync but neither will matter very much.
Have an extra serving of mashed potatoes for me!
Enjoy.
Etienne
For a competitive high school wrestler on the SCD, what would you suggest for before and after practice to improve energy and recovery? This has become a challenge. His goal is to drop 10 lbs. to a lower weight class. He will do this regardless so I want to make sure he does it safely. Thanks!
p.s. Regarding my last question for the high school wrestler. The SCD is working for him as far as getting close to his competition weight, however, he is losing steam and hour into his 2 hour training. Not sure where we should adjust. He has a SCD breakfast and lunch. It needs to be packable/portable-no microwave. He can’t consume anything during the 2 hours either. I’ve asked for help on a lot of forums with no response. I’m thinking of switching him to Paleo for Athletes.
Hey there PDX,
Certainly Paleo for Athletes address the carbohydrate energy concern that a wrestler must deal with going into a competition.
If you’d like to try to suggest modifications to his diet that are nearly SCD compliant maybe he could consume a salad that is no more then half lettuce. Fresh tuna and/or hard boiled eggs, tomatoes, avocado, beets, shredded carrots, cucumber, sliced almonds, red onion, red/green peppers, a few blue berries and even red or black beans with a fresh lemon juice+ balsamic + mustard dressing. Use a single head of romaine, and the rest of the above to make a very large bowl of salad (bigger then his head) and you should have something that is nearly SCD and/or Paleo for Athletes complainant.
Hope he wins!
Best,
Etienne
Whatever you do make sure he gets his energy, never mind the dogma. There is nothing harder that an athlete can do then wrestle on a competitive level.
Thanks, Etienne! That salad sounds delicious! Do you have any other good ideas for finger foods? He doesn’t actually sit down for lunch during school, he grazes from his lunchbox all day and works in a computer lab during his actual lunch period. I think I can make him that salad for breakfast but I’m not sure it’s practical during the day. Although, he might have to just find a way if he wants his energy back. I have been packing a lot of cut up veggies, lunch meat, almonds, nut butter, a protein shake, & Snapea Crisps. For breakfast this morning I made him grass fed beef and black bean tacos w/salsa on corn tortillas. After practice he has an apple and a protein bar. I just downloaded Paleo for Athletes on my Kindle. I hope to get some ideas there. He was 8th in state his Soph yr. Had a great record last yr. but lost in the final secs because he thought the match was over and got taken. This is his senior year-he’s hoping to place in state again.
Hey PDX,
His protein requirements are likely very high. Make sure he is really getting enough protein as the first order of business. Secondly as they point out in the intro or first chapter of Paleo for Athletes, muscle glycogen levels need to replaced soon after they are repleted. This means higher carb consumption (what the dense salads are meant to help provide) or careful chemistry involving simple sugars or fruit in or with his post workout shakes.
Preworkout whey protein shake | post workout whey + casein + frozen fruit or simple sugar) Fresh fruit on the side might do the trick.
Finger foods want to be protein or veggies as you are already doing. Flank steak cut into slices in small plastic bags work well. Hard boiled eggs as well. He’ll need something on the order of 1.5lbs+ of meat (less the grams of protein in his shakes) to keep to the 1 gram of protein to 1 lbs of body-weight rule of thumb. After that he’ll need to be monitored to make sure he never feels faint during a practice or competition. (More carbs if he does)
Lots of fish oil caps and cook his meat in coconut oil to keep omega 3/6 in balance will help also.
Tell ’em I said “break a leg”
Best,
Etienne
Thank you, Etienne! These are great suggestions. I just downloaded Paleo for Athletes so I will get busy reading it. I’ll tell him you said “break a leg”! I’ve been doing the SCD since the end of last December-it’s my lifestyle now :). I appreciate seeing all your great suggestions on this blog!
Hi Holly,
I’m so glad you’re helping your son to cut weight without damage. I know so many wrestlers who ruined their gut because of wrestling.
Since your son is not only an athlete but a growing athlete he has some very special needs. I am not an expert in this particular area however I do have a couple of suggestions along with a referral to someone who I think would and could answer your questions.
Your son may be doing a very low fat diet in addition to a low carb diet. This will leave him starving and out of steam after an hour. Therefore upping his fats is essential. He’s likely not going to like this idea because our society has been taught that eating fat makes you fat. This is untrue. It’s the type of fat along with the carbs that are the problem.
So, if he does go the salad route then he should eat an entire avocado in his salad along with nuts, seeds, meat, and plenty of oil in the dressing.
If he needs something quick to gulp down in between school and practice then I’d suggest whole raw milk (whole and raw are both essential. Raw milk has vital nutrients that make it a nutritional powerhouse. Full fat means that it combines with the protein in the milk to help move it through the body and disperse it evenly. This also means you’ll be putting a log on the fire instead of a piece of paper. Slow burn off). Add to that whole raw milk 2-3 egg yolks. (you can add the whites but they can make it a bit slimy. Save the whites for the omelet) Blend and drink. He can also add frozen fruit if he wants some flavor. If he actually needs something to eat at school send him a thermos with the ingredients (wrap the thermos in an ice pack to make sure it stays the proper temp) and get a him an inexpensive immersion blender. He can leave it in his locker and make his drink in the bathroom and rinse the blender and have it ready for the next day.
Again, I am not an expert in this department but fat and getting enough of it is where I would start.
Here’s the reference I was talking about. His name is Tim Huntley and he’s written for Robb Wolfs blog. His website is for “dedicated athletes” and his site URL is http://www.myathleticlife.com and his email is tim.huntley@myathleticlife.com. I’m going to email him to let him know that he might hear from you. He’s a really nice guy and since he’s Paleo I think you’ll mesh well with his suggestions.
Take care and hope you find the answers you are looking for!
Alison
Hey PDX,
I agree completely with Alison about the fat. The salad was supposed to include a full avocado, and fat from whatever protein source you put into it. (I use use fresh tuna and egg, but beef, pork, shrimp all work)
I also also agree whole milk if you’re going to do milk is the way to go. (I used to drink a gallon a day power lifting. I wasn’t thin though:-)
You can also add some coconut milk (+almond milk) to his whey drinks for a healthy fat source.
People, especially growing people need their fat.
Best,
Etienne
Hi Etienne, I saw that post last year when I was searching out safe ways to cut weight (as Tim writes, they will find their own way no matter what anyone says-but I think my son is smarter than that-he doesn’t want it THAT bad). It’s interesting but it still scares me. Most of the time weigh-ins are after school and then after traveling to the competition. His certifying weigh-in will be after school, they also do a hydration test. I need to study it again. Thanks, again!
Hey Eitenne & Alison,
[I already emailed Alison about this a while back], I’ve been meaning to type up all I did to help my son with his high school wrestling diet and will do that. I think I may start a blog myself. Anyway, thanks for all your help! We really worked out a great 4HB/Paleo for Athletes diet plan for him and he ended up getting super muscular, lean, strong, & fast. In fact, there wasn’t an event where a parent wouldn’t come up to me and ask what the heck I feed him. He rocked his season and ended up the REGIONAL CHAMP and went on to state. He didn’t place at state but I am convinced it is because he is also a full IB diploma candidate and had huge projects in the works and was basically staying up all night working on those for most of his season, especially during state (and still is)! Anyway, he figured out a great way to stay hydrated but also lose the excess water by drinking a bunch of water days before and then reducing intake to sips the day before the tourny. After weigh-ins, he would drink coconut water to rehydrate. This season was a breeze compared to all others-he was able to eat a ton, stay hydrated, and still make weight. The biggest benefit for our family is that he had a GREAT mood. Usually I hate wrestling season because of the whole cutting thing and mood but this one was amazing.
Alison & Etienne, Thank you so much for all your great input. I have suspected that he hasn’t been getting enough fat. I know for myself (my bf is below 12%-don’t worry, I’m beyond child bearing years), when I start to lose energy or have some other side effect, I up my healthy fat and the problem disappears. I’ll focus on that for him. I suspect he isn’t getting enough calories in general. I pack as much as I can and make it as tasty as possible but when I unpack at night, much is left-arg! I did pull out my calipers and do a 7-pt. Jackson Pollack body fat measurement on him and we determined together, that the weight that he wanted to wrestle at is not possible without putting himself in danger. I’m so glad we went through that drill! This kid would live on apples alone if I would allow it. Thanks again for your suggestions and for referring me to Tim Huntely, Alison. I know Tim Ferriss is busy with his new book to provide any input-I’ve tried. Too bad, as he was a competitive wrestler himself!
Hey PDX,
Pretty gruesome reading but here is Tim Ferris and friends on how to cut weight for competitive fighting/wrestling completion. (note as Tim says” Caveat emptor.Good luck to those whose sports require this. Train hard and drink smart. No medal is worth a Munzer-like ending. )
http://www.fourhourworkweek.com/blog/2008/01/18/how-to-cut-weight/
Will this diet work if say I have 10lbs to go? Will I also achieve that amazing drop in 2 weeks or mine will take longer since it’s the last hill?
I’m not so sure about the macadamia versus olive oil discussion as far as cooking temperature is concerned. Specifically, these folks disagree entirely, and suggest a few sources of data that seem reasonably inclined to lack bias.
http://www.oliveoilsource.com/page/heating-olive-oil
I’m glad your book introduced me to macadamia nut oil, as it certainly has a comparatively buttery taste; this, of course, makes it better suited than olive oil for many recipes. But I’m no longer convinced cooking temperature is a weakness of the olive’s oil.
This comment is a possible non sequitur, but I wasn’t sure where else to put it.
Thanks,
P
Tim,
Thanks for both books!
Using techniques I learned in the 4 Hour Body, I went from running a few times a week as part of an active lifestyle to completing a 65K (40 Mile) run in 14 weeks of training! If you’d like to know the details, feel free to contact me.
Troy
Hi all,
Quick question – will anti-biotics negate the effects/benefits of any or all of PAGG?
Thanks,
Tom
(lost 14kg, or 30lbs, in 9 weeks on SCD)
It’s after Thanksgiving and my weight is doing good at 236 lbs. I still have not reached my goal of 220, but I’m feeling good and my skin looks great. Still very happy with this life style change that I have choosen. When I started the diet on 7/18/11 my pants size was 44, I will be buying size 38’s for a Christmas party….HELL YEA !
mearsy,
Great job!
Keep up the great work.
Etienne
Hi!
Just got the book and have been reading voraciously. I am super excited about the slow carb diet and all the tips and tricks for losing fat. I am hoping to get my fiance on board with me on the slow carb diet – he is a little distressed about the weight he has gained in the past year or so.
THE PROBLEM: I won’t lie, I don’t always understand all the science involved, but it seems that many of the tricks seem to focus on getting nutrition straight to the muscles rather than having it stored as fat. My fiance has MUSCULAR DYSTROPHE. How will that affect his ability to benefit from the diet and exercise schedule laid out in the fat burning chapters?
Hi there Linden.
The SCD is a healthier way to eat. So it is hard to imagine that, broadly speaking, nearly everybody would benefit to one degree or another.
MUSCULAR DYSTROPHE is not something we here on this blog can’t help with because we are not medical doctors.
Why not just ask your fiance’s doctor directly?:-)
Good luck and welcome aboard.
Best,
Etienne
Hi,
I wanted to say I have been doing this for only a week and I can notice a change already. I have lost 5 pounds on the scale, and I was only 123lbs to begin . I am very short, with a small frame and was only looking to loose a few pounds and hopefully build some lean muscle with the help of the kettle bell.
What size kettle bell should I start out with?
Thanks
Quick Update:
I am now on WEEK 17 of the SCD. I have lost over 82 pounds. I added the kettlebell (3x a week 75 reps) and have gotten better results. I am still going to the gym M-F to do 30 mins of cardio. I can’t thank Tim and everyone who contributes to this board enough. It’s definitely not an easy diet (or lifestyle change in my experience) but if you stick to the rules and stay positive you will see results.
If your having any doubts as to whether to try the SCD -stop and embrace the moment. Get started right now.
Hey all,
So I’ve had a peanut and nut allergy all my life and have generally shied away from programs such as this because such an emphasis is placed on nuts and peanuts (peanut butter, almond butter, energy bars, etc) as a source of protein.
I am planning on trying to adapt and pursue the slow-carb diet in a few days and wanted to see if there were others out there with my issue or if anyone had suggestions and/or advice for replacing those items. I do realize it’s just another source of protein and this is all about doing what works for you, but I’d love to hear from others who may have the same or similar issues. Even just suggestions would be great.
Thanks in advance.
-Travis
Travis,
I’d say you’re in luck:-)
Nuts are not necessarily in fact they are a rather poor source of protein as most of their calories come from fat and the kind of fat you’d want to limit (omega 6 heavy).
Although it has taken me quite a while I’ve removed all nuts and legumes from my own diet. 1 gram of protein per lb of body-weight, (+/- 15 grams of fish oil for 210 lbs in body-weight)
Eggs, whites mostly, lots of fish, almost no chicken (that omega 6 thing again) and occasional beef (grass fed same reason) + 1-2 salads as big as your head.
BTW I lost 70+ lbs in less then a year on my increasingly stricter version of the SCD. It will work for you too w/o out nuts.
Good luck and welcome aboard!
Etienne
Travis-
Nuts are not essential. If you need to up your fat or have something quick before bed then you may want to give Tahini a try. It’s ground sesame seeds and is really good. It is very high in iron and isn’t as sweet as say peanut butter, but it’s high in healthy fat and protein. I like the Artisana brand but you’d have to check to see if it’s processed in a facility that processes other nuts.
I eat vegetarian on my non-cheat days and I only use nut butter when I think I am way too low on calories for the day or I need a premade meal that doesn’t require refrigeration. My protein comes from legumes, vegetables, cottage cheese and egg whites/eggs.
I think you can do just fine without them. I don’t recall them being so important except for the example about eating almonds instead of blowing it at the airport.
Hey,
I’m just wondering about the binge day. Is it okay to have the binge day on a different day each week?
Say my friend suggests going to an all-you-can-eat on friday, so I go and take Friday as my binge day. Next week, I’m tempted and have my binge day on the Wednesday. The next week I have it on the Saturday. Is this okay or does it have to be regular aka every saturday?
Thanks
Hey Alison & Eitenne-Thanks for your help with my high school wrestler-so far so good. I have to say it’s been the easiest season by far regarding maintaining weight and MOOD! He’s been wrestling super strong too (pinning his opponent most matches and losing just a few). The mood thing is incredible. His teammates are taking notice and other parents are asking me for advice. Thanks, again!
Hey Everyone,
Just got my yearly blood work back-been doing the slow carb diet since Dec ’10 (however, I recently removed legumes and added in a bit of yams/fruit on occasion to see if it affected my Reynaud’s syndrome and it did greatly reduce the symptoms)-I still use Tim’s ideas/rules and workouts (& weekly cheat-except this month). I’ve been keeping blood work records for the last 8 years. Have been fit and trim and mostly eating Mediterranean type diet (low fat/whole grains) for many years before the 4HB/SCD. Best blood work ever-GOOD cholesterol UP, BAD DOWN, triglycerides DOWN-everything besides Vit D (same as last yr) looks great/normal. Body fat in athletic range. Thanks! Just gotta get that Vit D up!
Holly,
Congrats on the great blood work results!
I’ve been meaning to respond to your earlier post about your son. I’m so glad it’s worked out and that he’s been less grumpy. That’s major for a teen! I’m curious as to what protocol/diet he ended up following and what exactly he’s been eating?
Hi Alison,
Here is what my high school wrestler is doing. First of all, he’s not 100% compliant, after all, he’s a teenager, however, he’s doing exceptionally well overall. My husband talked him into doing it after pointing out that whatever the heck I have been doing melted off all my excess body fat (really skinny fat for me). Anyway, he’s doing mostly a modified hybrid of the slow carb diet and Paleo w/ once a week cheat days. This system has worked GREAT compared with his past seasons. He’s having a great season as well, very strong. Now if I could only reduce his school-work load so he can sleep enough! For all the meals below, in general, I try to be heavy handed with fat.
Breakfast:
Grass fed hamburger and about 1/4 to 1/2 cup of yams or sweet potatoes (I use grass fed butter/ghee and/or EVOO to season)-sometimes bacon.
Lunch:
Thermos of ½ lb. of shrimp either drizzled w/EVOO & balsamic w/pepper and basil OR cooked in grass fed butter/ghee w/garlic & basil & pepper.
Can of sardines
Cut up veggies (usually baby carrots)
Macadamias
Almond butter (he decided he doesn’t like it anymore though)
Snack before practice:
Some sort of small protein bar, I try to buy gluten free but he likes Balance Bars (Balance Bars are about to release a gluten free version)
Tangerine
Post work out:
Fruit smoothie w/grass fed non-homogenized whole milk (we can’t get raw in stores in OR)
Dinner:
Meat or salmon, big salad, & sweet potatoes/yams
Sometimes he’ll have corn tortillas as a wrap
Typically has salmon the day before a meet
Days Before Meet:
He drinks as much water as he can until the day before, then sips all day. He may skip yams at meals and post workout fruit smoothie and replace post workout with Balance Bar.
At Meets:
Pedialyte after weigh in (he loves and and says it makes him feel so good so we keep it in)
Thermos of shrimp and thermos of mashed yams, bananas, tangerines, Trader Joe’s Buffalo Jerky, Honey Stinger Energy Chews, Sweet Riot 70% chocolate covered nibs w/espresso. Coconut water.
Snacks:
Omelets or scrambled eggs
Sometimes an apple post workout
Carrots
I used to buy Snap Crisps but stopped recently
Dry Roasted Root Veggie Mix in bulk food section of my grocery store
Dark Chocolate
Sardines
Macadamias (however, at this writing, he is sick of them)
Your son is extremely lucky to have a dedicated
Mom like you.
Can’t stomach all the beans after a while? Make yourself a batch of Mashed PoBEANoes!
Take 2 cans of beans, which you can mix and match to come up with new flavours, add some liquid like sugar free broth, tomato sauce, onion soup mix or whatever you like, then MASH (Or blend) and add any spices you like!
You’ll get about 6-8 servings of a great bean side, that you can heat beside your vegetables in the microwave, that does not taste like beans or require chasing around your plate with a fork!
it is even better tasting mashed no-tatoes if you take 1/2 beans, half cauliflower and a clove of garlic.
hmmmm!
Gosh you’re a cutie.
Can’t believe the sheer volume of questions you’ve been getting here.
Whatever happened to self experimentation? It’s such a shame that everyone seems to need a personal guru to answer every little query.
They seem to think you’re some kind of all-knowing god. More power to you I suppose.
Anyway, the 4 hour body was an entertaining read, and I’m feeling good messing about with the diet, figuring out what works best and is most sustainable for me.
Hey, new to the diet and was wondering if i could use almond or coconut milk in my protein shake, i can’t stand it with just water, thanks 🙂
Hey mickenzy
You sure can! I’ve GREAT results and my morning whey protein shakes includes both. I’d say if you limit the coconut milk to 1/4 can per day ypu’ll be just fine..
Good luck!
Best
Etienne
Hi Tim, great book. What do you think about the Vega protein shakes? I am curious, because I saw that some people are not a fan of the vegetarian shakes.