This is not going to be a long-form interview where I dissect and deconstruct a world-class performer…at least not in the usual fashion. Instead, this is a special edition of The Random Show.
I am joined by Kevin Rose (@KevinRose), serial entrepreneur, world-class investor, and all around wild and crazy guy. We discuss a wide range of topics, including new favorite books, memory training, meditation tactics, multiple wives, and bets for or against virtual reality.
If you only have 5 minutes, here’s an untold story about a body experiment I wish I didn’t do.
- Listen to it on iTunes.
- Stream by clicking here.
- Download as an MP3 by right-clicking here and choosing “save as.”
Want to hear another episode of The Random Show? — Listen to this earlier conversation with Kevin Rose. In this episode, we discuss saunas and cold treatment, dating apps, and fitness apps (stream below or right-click here to download):
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Check out wealthfront.com/tim, take their risk assessment quiz, which only takes 2-5 minutes, and they’ll show you — for free — exactly the portfolio they’d put you in. If you want to just take their advice and do it yourself, you can. Well worth a few minutes to explore: wealthfront.com/tim.
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QUESTION(S) OF THE DAY: What was your favorite quote or lesson from this episode? Please let me know in the comments.
Scroll below for links and show notes…
Selected Links from the Episode
- Connect with Kevin Rose:
- Transcendental meditation
- Mindfulness meditation
- Get Some Headspace: How Mindfulness Can Change Your Life in Ten Minutes a Day by Andy Puddicombe
- White Noise machines
- Headspace app
- Calm app
- Brain Pickings
- Guided Meditations by Tara Brach
- How to Meditate by Sam Harris
- How to Get Filthy Rich in Rising Asia by Mohsin Hamid
- Love and Ambition in a Cruel New World by Michiko Kakutani, The New York Times
- Night Sky with Exit Wounds by Ocean Vuong
- Vagabonding: An Uncommon Guide to the Art of Long-Term World Travel by Rolf Potts
- First batch of t-shirts — 100% of proceeds will be donated to groundbreaking scientific studies of psilocybin.
- More detailed information about why I’m funding psilocybin research.
- Moonwalking with Einstein: The Art and Science of Remembering Everything by Joshua Foer
- Memory Palace (Method of loci)
- Ed Cooke, Grandmaster of Memory
- Your Memory: How It Works and How to Improve It by Kenneth L. Higbee Ph.D.
- The Mind of a Mnemonist: A Little Book about a Vast Memory by Aleksandr R. Luria
- Rain Man
- tDCS (Transcranial direct-current stimulation)
- Black Mirror
- Google’s ‘Black Mirror’ Patent Could Let Us Record And Replay Our Memories by Thomas Tamblyn, Huffpost Tech UK
- Second Life
- Kevin’s first Foundation episode with Philip Rosedale — and second.
- Kevin’s episode with Jason Fried on The Journal
- Barrel saunas
- Tribe: On Homecoming and Belonging by Sebastian Junger
- The Miracle of Mindfulness: An Introduction to the Practice of Meditation by Thich Nhat Hanh
- The Wisdom of Crowds: Why the Many Are Smarter Than the Few and How Collective Wisdom Shapes Business…Economies, Societies… by James Surowiecki
- Green Eggs and Ham by Dr. Seuss
- Kevin’s interview with paper guru Brad Dowdy on The Journal
- Uni-ball 307 Gel Pen
- Uni-ball Signo 207 Retractable Gel Pen (micro point)
- Uni-ball Signo 207 Retractable Gel Pen (medium point)
- Pilot Precise V5 Stick Rolling Ball Pen (extra fine point)
- What it’s like to get a muscle biopsy with a giant needle.
- Sports Science Institute of South Africa
- Siamese fighting fish
- Virtual reality
- Augmented reality
- X (formerly known as Google X)
- Suntory Hibiki 30-year-old Japanese whisky
- The origin story of #timtimtalktalk. [06:26]
- Hard-hitting questions: turnabout is fair play. [07:33]
- We talk TM (transcendental meditation). [08:39]
- How mantras are used in meditation. [12:13]
- At a four-day training course, Kevin was disappointed by TM on day one — but a believer by day two. [14:34]
- The benefits of learning meditation with others vs. just doing it yourself. [15:55]
- The post-meditation daze and going too deep. (“That’s what she said.”) [18:00]
- The progress we make from meditation may be realized by others before we notice it ourselves. [19:09]
- Experimenting with our own mantras. [21:01]
- I enjoy having a few superstitions. [21:41]
- Other forms of meditation and where to learn more about them. [22:47]
- Meditation — like slacklining or snowboarding — can be frustrating for beginners. [24:23]
- Meditation is a foundational skill of Stoicism. [26:02]
- Why I reversed my early snobbery toward fiction books and poetry; I share some of my recent discoveries. [26:45]
- I’m donating money and selling t-shirts to support university research into psilocybin for treating conditions such as depression, end-of-life anxiety in cancer patients, etc. [35:21]
- Why psilocybin research is so expensive in comparison to Kevin’s experience with mushrooms in college. [41:43]
- We talk about memory champions, techniques used for memorization — like the memory palace — and favorite books related to memory improvement. [48:26]
- Black Mirror is a great series if you can get past the first episode. [1:00:14]
- One illegal substance that has changed me for the better — and why. [1:01:35]
- “If you are depressed, you are living in the past.
If you are anxious, you are living in the future.
If you are at peace, you are living in the present.” –Lao Tzu [1:02:48]
- The first person who comes to mind when Kevin hears the word “successful.” [1:05:56]
- The Philip Rosedale “mantra based on counting” method of meditation isn’t for everybody. [1:10:48]
- If I could change any law not related to mind-altering substances, what would it be? [1:11:51]
- Books Kevin has gifted most to other people. [1:16:49]
- Purchase of $100 or less that had a positive impact on Kevin’s life. [1:18:28]
- A body experiment I wish I hadn’t done. [1:20:24]
- What advice would Kevin give to his 25-year-old self? [1:26:31]
- Bad advice Kevin hears frequently being dispensed to new startup founders. [1:30:06]
- Biggest misconception people have about me. [1:38:00]
- #timtimdatedate [1:39:25]
- Parting thoughts on virtual reality, hype cycles, augmented reality, betting against neuroscientists, the disappointment of Google Glass, and Japanese whisky. [1:46:40]
- Dr. Peter Attia
- Chase Jarvis
- Rick Rubin
- Maharishi Mahesh Yogi
- Darya Rose
- Tara Brach
- Maria Popova
- Sam Harris
- Chris Sacca
- Mohsin Hamid
- Michiko Kakutani
- Ocean Vuong
- Rolf Potts
- Joshua Foer
- Ed Cooke
- Lao Tzu
- Philip Rosedale
- Elon Musk
- Larry Page
- Jason Fried
- Peter Thiel
- Laird Hamilton
- Sebastian Junger
- Brad Dowdy
- Tim Noakes
- David Sinclair
- Adam Gazzaley
The Tim Ferriss Show is one of the most popular podcasts in the world with more than 900 million downloads. It has been selected for "Best of Apple Podcasts" three times, it is often the #1 interview podcast across all of Apple Podcasts, and it's been ranked #1 out of 400,000+ podcasts on many occasions. To listen to any of the past episodes for free, check out this page.
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117 Replies to “The Random Show – New Favorite Books, Memory Training, and Bets On VR (#171)”
Tim, I like: The randow show, but i want to see you guys. Just an audio is not good. It is boring and much less interesting. The show strong part are the dynamics of you two. Put on a video episode also if you can each time you do a random show. This idea is also better for your audio podcast in general. If you put two options, audio and video you will get a bigger and more grateull audience. Thanks for all your good work.
I don’t agree with this at all. Why would two talking heads be worth the extra bandwidth? Tim is a good looking guy and everything but really…
Tim, you linked to some network marketing organization that sells supplements and your show notes, Usana!😧 The organization you meant to link to is Usona. Here’s the link – http://www.usonainstitute.org/research/
Oh, good lord. I’ll fix that right now. Thanks for the heads up!
Hi Tim. Great content as always. Your podcasts allow us to be a fly on the wall for your conversations. Thinking back to your interview with Shay regarding a low barrier of entry in creating interesting YouTube content, adding a 360 camera during your interviews would take the “fly on the wall” to the next level. Hope you would do that. I would definitely watch and enjoy. I’m sure others would too.
SO wish you still did this as videos 😢
Again no video? Please bring back the video, it was a big part of the appeal of the random show.
Bring back video. Video = show, audio = podcast. The random podcast.. plz no.
Hey Tim, first person uses “I.” When the narrator uses “you,” that’s second person.
Doh! You’re totally right. Thanks for the correx.
First off, I absolutely love the show. Thank you so much for creating such an engaging podcast. The recent Sebastian Junger episode absolutely blew me away. So good.
I just wanted to leave a little note regarding Transcendental Meditation. While I practice mediation myself and I’m a big believer in the benefits of mindfulness / meditation, I would be very weary of recommending TM. I’ll try to keep it short, but I’ve heard horror stories about the TM movement being a cult, from people that were very involved in it. One good friend in particular whose whole family moved from Australia to the TM community in Iowa were left financially devastated. What he described to me was absolutely cultish. Just because a couple of people have negative things to say doesn’t it make it true, but if you do a little research online, you’ll find a surprising amount of anti TM blogs out there, trying to warn people from the TM movement. There’s got to be reason for that.
Even the Wikipedia link to the Transcendental Meditation movement gives a broader overview than the basic link for TM that you’ve got listed.
I’m not saying that I think they’re all bad people, but it might be wise to do a little research before getting involved.
Anyways, thanks again for a wonderful show.
This addresses an earlier podcast –
Existential “a lone ness” and your late night writing routine
For all the amazing things you have accomplished and brought forward into the world, I would suggest the most difficult would be for you to do your writing routine from 11pm to 3 pm without the loping movie and music. These appear to be distractions from the ultimate test in life. Who are we really? Could it be that we don’t want to feel alone in our homes late at night so we introduce visual and audible stimuli to mask the underlying fear of our apparent separateness. However when faced completely we find we are not alone at all, but rather the all of it and we rest in an indescribable bliss. And in that state we find ourselves highly creative and feel a sense of fullness. From here anything is possible.
I have a friend who is ADHD subtype “ring of fire”. When they look at his brain, and it’s “on” there is literally a red ring of on-ness. No other ADD or ADHD subtype has this, nor do non-AD(H)D brains.
There are very specific input/output needs to optimize this type of brain. Things that seem very odd to “normal” brains.
Before he learned to manage his brain, he would always say “I’m losing packets”. He did a ton of experiments to figure it out and once he found his “optimal”, he could run circles of accomplishment around anyone we knew.
When there was too little input, or not enough change of scenery, he couldn’t focus. His brain needed more input that it was receiving.
If he failed to change to a different “thing to focus on” after X hrs, he became unproductive.
He set up 4 different laptop locations in his home, and set them up to meet various needs. One of those was the wall-screen projector tv where he would often do the same thing – turn off the sound & turn on the music.
Some brains need “something to ignore” to get things done.
Other brains need “super quiet no distractions” to get anything done.
We all have to figure out what we need, and how best to meet those needs for the tasks at hand.
I just love your podcasts-thank you.
This is only good with video. The random show in only podcast is bad.
You will lose audience. It was special because of your faces and dynamics. Really. I have seen all the random shows.
A serious and constructive positive advice.
Thank you for all you have done
I just wanted to say that Mohsin Hamid is on of my favorite authors and I was pleasantly surprised to see him and his book mentioned in the podcast. I recommend reading other books by Mohsin Hamid as well, specially The Reluctant Fundamentalist as it will really put things in perspective for lots of people.
tim you are my white noise machine
You give more than you take bro, really respect that.
Hey Tim, long-time fan. Looking forward to listening to this Random Show episode. I know you dig hard-edged music. You should give Refused “The Shape of Punk to Come” a listen some time. Seminal hardcore album. Classic track: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=NkAe30aEG5c&list=PLCpOrUWdHBXvWBXeBO4GjQ5vBisiOHG98
Where’s the video?
Like man people, this would be better in video form. But still a great podcast.
Hey Tim longtime listener and lurker here,
If there’s one thing I’ve learned from my years of reading your books and listening to your podcasts it’s that anyone has the capacity to do anything.
I took real issue when you mentioned that you “don’t have the hubris” to assume that you “have the capacity to be a poet”.
That’s absolute bullshit. Any one of us can do anything (within reason) and that’s the whole point of the Tim Ferriss experiment (for me at least).
Thank you, Justin.
You are probably an OK person but your podcasts are way too long for not much. Lot of useless chatter to find a useful tidbit… peace…. out.
Nice one Tim ! Just ordered my T shirt, £25 with shipping to the UK. Bargain !
Keep up the excellent work.
Love that you are getting more publicly involved in the topic of depression. It will be fascinating to see what results come from the psilocybin research you are funding.
As a podcast topic/guest suggestion you should have a look at Dr Kelly Brogan’s work especially since you are a fan of Dr Rhonda Patrick and Peter Attia. She did her fellowship at NYU Medical Center after graduating from Cornell University Medical College, and has a B.S. from MIT in Systems Neuroscience.
She has some pretty fascinating things to say about antidepressants worsening the long-term course of depression (tardive dysphoria/oppositional tolerance) as well as the treatment of depression through nutrition.
She has recently released a book but main stream media outlets have basically blacklisted her, likely because of their primary sponsorship by pharmaceutical companies.
Worth checking out!
I was wondering about the hurdles for the depression research.
If it is so expensive in the US due to restrictions on sourcing the drugs themselves, can’t you use some jurisdiction arbitrage?
Do the most groundbreaking work first in less restrictive countries which would allow more bang for your research dollars, i.e. for the same money you could have a lot more participants because drugs/ legislation cost per participant would go down an order of magnitude at least.
Once those results are in you might have a better shot at creating a high volume study which would allow for a bulk production approach and economies of scale?
(I am operating under the perhaps naive assumption that science is international and that results in other countries would have the same weight as a Johns Hopkins study. Surely Johns Hopkins has some international collaboration partners which would allow them to access the data freely? )
@kevinrose – who needs a while room when you can VR in a hamster ball: http://www.virtusphere.com/
Don’t ask me how I found that, I have no idea. though the exact same idea was in the novel Ready Player One, where VR + second life has more or less replaced the internet as where everyone spends their time. An interesting and hilarious read especially if you like the 80s.
Definitely agree that prefect memory would suck the big one, having given birth last year. If I hadn’t already forgotten just how painful that was, I wouldn’t want another one (though biology probably has something to do with that too)
Finally, a random suggestion after a random show, someone I admire who you might find interesting enough to interview one day is Daniel Flynn of Thankyou, a 100% for charity FMCG company here in Australia. His book, Chapter One, sells here in bookstores for whatever you want to pay for it. Their products are amazing and each one has a code which you can use to track your impact – it shows where the money you spent on the product goes to helping people access clean water, sanitation and food security. Really awesome guy, he started when he was 19 and he’s only like 28 now. They also pulled some crazy audacious marketing tricks to get 7-11 and then our two major supermarkets to stock their products.
I love your interview style and rapport, so I think that’d make for a great show 🙂
Cheers brah, take it sleazy.
Actually, I CAN’T watch the video because I’m either driving or at work.. you know – working.
Great episode as are all of the Random Shows. If you haven’t listened to it, the episode of The Journal about pens and notebooks is mind blowing if you have any interest in those items. Also, the Precise pen mentioned above is a great pen with good ink. I have used them for years.
When you do field interviews in other people’s spaces, what sort of audio recording gear do you use? Just an Iphone?
Great to hear you talking about VR S*x; last month saw the latest at this event in Tokyo, quite amazing: http://kotaku.com/adult-vr-festival-draws-huge-crowds-in-japan-1781869098 We’re developing a product that will ship next month. The future is wild.
The quote in the show notes is misattributed to Lao Tzu (Laozi) it’s actually from the book “Jimmy R.” in Days of Healing, Days of Joy (1987)
Had to laugh. I’m Japanese and Italian. Or as I like to call me, wopanese.
I have been listening to 4 hour workweek and loving it! I am looking for a resource from the community-best way to sell a poster that I’ve designed myself….online….somewhere that handles the printing and shipping if I have the design…..and doesn’t take all the money.
I’ve been doing research and am overwhelmed by options.
[Moderator: Email address removed]
Who dates Tim Ferriss?
Some brainstorming questions for you:
~ Monogamy ~
Are you capable of monogamy?
Alison Armstrong tells women “If a man says he can’t be monogamous, believe him. He is telling you something important about himself. Do not think you can change him.”
She says that cheating and mistresses used to work in society because the wife was legally guaranteed security. That no matter what, he would always save her first, always provide for her first. That her role in his life as queen to his king and kingdom were hers and hers alone.
~ Personal Growth ~
Is this important to you in another person? Would you be ok with someone who isn’t interested constant neverending improvement?
(I suspect this is one of your deal-breakers.)
~ Routines ~
Asking ahead to 68 year old married Tim, how entwined does Tim need his amazing wife to be?
When you pull out the equivalent of Tea & Laptop to start your writing at 10pm, where is your wife? Is she in bed? Is she on her laptop in across the room writing/coding/working with her business partners in Australia?
Or would that feel invasive of “me time”?
What does travel look like?
A homebody greeting you with open arms when you return from your journeys? Or is she by your side sharing the experiences in real time? Combo?
Do you want her involved with some or all of your experiments?
Do you prefer she has her own focus/mission and you tell her about your crazy day later? Maybe she’s got a research scientist mind & is geeking out with you?
Would you want your marriage public or private?
You are very open and authentic and share details of your life with the world. Would you be ok with a “very private” person? Or would you be co-publishing relationship content? Would you be thrilled beyond belief if she were running her own experiments on your children?
~ Wee Ones ~
Do you want your kids lives public? anonymous? identity protected before a certain age?
What do you think / how do you feel about upending your life for a helpless human?
(They are cute, but they are totally reliant for the first several years, they find all your buttons, and push the crap out of them.) Teaching the ABC’s, and tying shoes is going to feel very different than the cutting edge teaching you do now.
Would you compromise dad-time to keep on your “teach the world” mission? Is that ok with you? Is that ok with your blushing bride pulling the heavy lifting of child influence?
~ Old Age ~
Your buddies in SValley may or may not have old age solved by the time you’re 98, pretending that they haven’t for the sake of self-inquiry:
Do you want to face mortality alone?
Would you like someone by your side as your body begins to fade? Would you be willing to be at her side as her body fades? (or, let’s be real, you’d be in the lab madly solving whatever ails her!)
~ Relating ~
When there is heated controversy, how do you fight? What if she fights the opposite? Are you willing to co-create unique styles of resolution that work for both?
What is your primary language of love/appreciation? / How do you most feel loved?
Acts of service?
Physical touch? (everyone needs sex, this is the sitting on the couch in physical contact type of stuff)
~ The Integrated Human ~
the masculine is traditionally the protector & provider
the feminine traditionally holds the space of support & enhance
the upward spiral of a relationship:
he makes her happy, when she’s happy she is glowing and that gives him life, when he is full of life he that makes her happy, when she’s happy that gives him life …
We all have access to feminine and masculine “traits” in varying degrees. Generationally in America men and women have explored shunning our birth traits and exploring the “other side”. And those in to personal growth have found that we aren’t feeling very whole with 1/2 of us shoved aside.
The cutting edge humans are diving back in to the side they haven’t fully owned yet and learning to be Integrated Humans with access to all their super powers.
What does an integrated relationship look like? Gay & Katie Hendricks shed some light. They suggest that we automatically take on the role that isn’t being played. That self-aware humans pick up on this & mix it up. Break stuck-roles & co-create something new.
You said you have dated masculine-focused women, and feminine-focused women, and both work for you as long as no one’s trying to dominate you.
What might it look like be a relationship with an integrated or integrating (workin on it) human?
just tossing out thoughts for you to play with, in case some of them hadn’t crossed your mind yet
(apologies for verbosity & intensity)
as always, a podcast worth gold, freely given to the world
so very very grateful
This is great. I’d read the book.
This comment made me stop and think… And really think about what I want in a partner (and why haven’t I asked myself these questions before?). Thanks for chiming in with this, I’ll be chewing on this a bit.
What are the shirts made of?
Thanks for the episode, and the help towards research for psychedelics…
I love psychedelics 🙂 lol
Long-time listener, first-time commenter.
Really enjoyed this random episode. Keep up the great work, Tim.
(Also, the Show Notes are missing a link to the ‘Fog of War” documentary you mentioned: http://www.sonyclassics.com/fogofwar)
I remember Kevin said ” Blogging is so stupid” and he has his own blog, than he said “podcasting is stupid, you should do videos” and then he saw that podcasting is quite beneficial and now he said – “Virtual reality is so stupid”, i am really excited to see the future of virtual reality. 😀 ^^ PS Kevin we still love you, it´s just funny.
Italo Calvino’s “If On A Winter’s Night A Traveller” is also written in the 2nd person.
Tim, any chances of getting Daniel Kahneman to the podcast? Would be amazing!
Podcast Guest Suggestion: General Michael Hayden. He gave an A-list performance on the B-list podcast Art of Charm – I can only imagine what he’d do on The Tim Ferris Show: 🙂
Great show! Here is a fitbit cock ring by the way. Hahaha. http://www.engadget.com/2015/06/04/lovely-genital-activity-tracker/?utm_source=Feed_Classic_Full&utm_medium=feed&utm_campaign=Engadget&?ncid=rss_full
You mentioned the world’s best pens during the podcast. Could you post the links like you promised. Love the podcast!
Hey Tim, any chance of sharing those sauna plans.
Darya was definitely the hero of this episode. 🙂
Just wanted to say thanks for THE MOST entertaining episode I’ve listened to on a Podcast, with an awesome range of topics covered.
Came here to get the link to the pens, but had to say thanks!
Tim, I loved the libertarian bit in this podcast. Here’s a common joke from us anarcho-capitalists to dig at your anarchist jab, however. 😉
Q. “What’s the difference between a libertarian and an anarchist?
A. “6 months”
This 6 month journey often starts with reading:
1. Rothbard (If you like hard medicine)
I’d start here: https://mises.org/library/anatomy-state/html/c/31
2. Tom Woods (If you like slightly less-hard medicine)
I’d start here: https://www.amazon.com/Real-Dissent-Libertarian-Allowable-Opinion-ebook/dp/B00N71YJQU
I just have too damn many emails every day to read, thanks for keeping it real
I enjoyed this episode quite a bit, however, I couldn’t possibly disagree more with Kevin on the future of virtual reality. I feel that seeing VR as a fad similar to 3D TV shows a profound lack of imagination. Do you honestly believe that flat screens are the best we can do as a species?
VR isn’t a minor iteration on an existing technology, it’s a step-change, a whole new medium. I agree with you that seeing a whale swim around won’t be enough to sell an HMD that costs many hundreds of dollars, and I agree that the technology is bulky and sometimes even uncomfortable, however, I believe that many of the early experiences are so compelling that people will see past these initial growing pains and help the industry continue to grow.
If you’ve only tried a few demos, I encourage you to visit a friend’s place and try an actual game. The number of games and users is growing daily, and I’ll be amazed if you don’t see at least a hint of greatness.
Five years from now, I think you’ll look back on this as your “640K ought to be enough for anybody” moment.
Good conversation about VR. The way I see it, the industry will naturally start via games bec majority of the users will be teenagers. You won’t expect a 40 above yrs old person using it unless if it’s for medical purposes. Now as those teenagers grew older, the diversity and use will broaden too because those people already developed the habit of using it so the behavior will be normal to them.
Tim, I wanted to leave a comment to the point in the conversation where you were talking about meditation. I am aware that you want to take a stance to where you do don’t express your feelings about belief and religion, but I wanted to know why you have never had a person of Christian faith. I enjoy your variety of people interviewed, but have noticed as i have went through each episode. It’s a recurring theme of non belief in God, but a constant search for something more rather it be drugs or meditation, etc. This comment came about when the guest mentioned the sacrifice to a man who was the head of the meditation exercise and then made a comment about how he grew up religious and drank the blood of Christ as if that was crazy. I know it was a joke, but It just struck me to wonder why the man found it worthwhile to take a sacrifice to a meditation and not find it Looney. Most people you have on here are usually of the same belief in nothing, but you interview interesting and great people at what they they do so why is it you do not interview someone of faith that is doing something great in the world, just like these people. You want to ask and interview people who are outliers and different from the rest, but from what I see and here are the same people on every mainstream podcast. Throw your listener’s for a twist. Even if you dont agree on what chriatians believe shouldn’t you ask them the hard questions and why they choose to believe in what they do.
All Christians, Tim interviews all.
People’s faith talk belong on faith based podcasts.
Tim Tim Talk Talk is not one of those genres.
Keep it real Tim!
I’ve spent hundreds of dollars on pens. I love pens. When you mentioned the pen expert I had a fuckin orgasm (figuratively) and I couldn’t pay attention to what else you were saying for about 10 minutes. I welcome the nerd.
Great episode of TimTimTalkTalk, guys. Always great to hear the two of you chat.
Also, thanks for the massive endorsement for memory techniques and mnemonics. My “muse” business (which ended up becoming my full time gig and major passion) is teaching online courses and publishing books on accelerated learning, memory, and speed reading [Moderator: link removed], and your enthusiasm about these techniques is a huge nod to our work and a shining example of how someone can use these age-old tricks to get very, very far in life.
You continue to be a source of inspiration in my life, and have influenced me in more ways than you know, brother! Hope to see you at Summit one of these days and thank you in person for all you’ve done.
On meditation, at some point you should take a look at this:
The Presence Process: A Journey Into Present Moment Awareness-by Michael Brown.
Tim & Kevin, thank you! Great show!. Re. your meditation riff: Here’s a little wannabe Koan:
The plum is not the point.
The point is not the plum.
The point is the point.
Thanks again, guys. Be present! Be blessed! Be!
Strange how I remember this, but your description of the experiment with Resveratrol sounds like a scene right out of “Van Wilder” – https://youtu.be/oXouSM2JOZk Guessi
Kevin touched on it at the end but I’d love to know what shirts you are sourcing for the fundraiser. I desperately need some good shirts to print on and would love to hear what you came up with!
Thanks a lot Tim and keep doing what u do. It means a lot to my friends and me.
Besides defecating, what do you do while sitting on the toilet?
Great show guys! I really enjoyed how you two could actually make jokes and relate with each other. You can really tell when you have a good relationship with your guest and when it is just another interview, not that those interviews are of poor quality, I just appreciate listening to the banter between friends!
Best part of the show are all the asides to and from Darya.
In regards to TM, I think your suggestions Tim to Kevin are kind of a mixed bag. He should just follow his given instructions and find his own way. I know you are an endless hacker, but in the final analysis, one is either doing TM or you are doing something else. You chose a brand named technique complete with woo-woo over all the other techniques out there. I would just stick with the girl that brought you to the dance and try TM as instructed. This may go against your very raison d’être.
I say this in all sincerity and respect for you guys as I am a big fan of you both. However, I’m 62 and have been meditating TM style since I got instructed in college in 1975 for the grand some of $75. I had just seen Clint Eastwood on the Merv Griffin show with the Maharishi and he was extolling its benefits along with other luminaries.
Anyway, the whole point of meditation and the function of the mantra is not a “doing” but a “being”. It is to keep your awareness busy long enough that your mind realizes that its thoughts are not the mind and awareness is separate from thoughts. It’s the separation from thoughts into just awareness of awareness that brings on all the mental and physiological benefits, like the deep rest, reduction in cortisol, reduction in BP, heart rate, and so on. The meditation is the hack. In a reallly good meditation thoughts go away entirely and there is just awareness by itself. That gift is quite healing and empowering.
Also, I like what DLF is doing, but I have managed to largely stay away from the TM movement these past decades since they are a cult. I signed up for peace of mind, not a life style, and that has worked out well. I also took off 1 year from meditation in 1989 to see who I was as a person and to see if there is was any difference in my life or were the benefits merely self delusion. I definitely feel better for doing it and picked up the practice in 1990.
PS: I love the fund raiser you are nuturing along to get psychedelics serious reconsidered by earnest scientist. It is long overdue and this witch hunt against psychedelics needs to stoop.
Tim, I can’t get enough of your show. I wish you could do more and longer episodes even if it’s just you talking alone about things you want to. Keep it up and thanks!
Great show as always! You guys inspired me to get back to reading fiction. If I may, I’d like to suggest that you interview Darya. I just listened to Foodist on Audible and loved it. You guys have different food philosophies but similar habit-centered approaches, so it might make for an interesting conversation.
You guys rock! More Random Shows please 🙂
Since I was driving I was glad there was audio only… and it was a long drive!
Hope we can play catch someday!
Oooh 61 comments. Looks like your 15 minutes is just about up Timmy. You’re lack of giving the people what they want is now showing, random show videos used to get hundreds of comments, you thought you would do it your way and not listen to the people. It was a good ride though, huh?
I don’t understand all the issues about no video? Who has time to stare at a screen for 1.5 – 2 hours?
I love the podcasts. I can listen to them driving, exercising, working, at home – anywhere and anytime. Awesomeness!
I agree completely. What’s up with men wanting to sit down and watch 2 men talking for 2 hours? Weird.
I have been listening to your show for a long time and so I want to thank you for dedication and tireless efforts to bring all these interesting topics and people so intimately close to the rest of the world.
However, I did realize today that the majority of your guests are of very similar attributes, I would love to hear you crack secrets of various ages, genders and social backgrounds wide open.
All the best!
Tried to buy a shroom shirt, but the campaign is ended and the Buy button is dead. Any chance shirts will be available again?
Hey Tim, I’m heartbroken that I missed the deadline to order an Atoms to Neurons shirt! Will you please sell more?
Great episode! Always love the random shows.
It sounds like you have a noise gate in your audio postproduction. Maybe it’s just me but it might be too aggressive. Pauses sound unnatural because the background gets clamped too quickly.
Definitely not a dealbreaker though. Keep it up!
Minor detail but ‘Vive’ in HTC Vive is pronounced vive (rhymes with hive) and not veeve. If my memory is correct ‘HTC ReVive’ was the working title for the prototype at one point so that’s where the name Vive came from.
As a developer of a small indie VR game, Kevin’s take on VR was very familiar to me. His arguments against VR reflect the common misconceptions held by people who haven’t really spend any or much time with VR.
Arguments such as needing to have an entire room dedicated for VR or drawing parallels between VR and 3DTV or Wii show a big misunderstanding of VR. As VR becomes more common, these misconceptions will hopefully start to die off.
As a side note, you really should interview somebody from Valve in a future podcast. I recommend Gabe Newell or Chet Faliszek if you want to talk about storytelling in different mediums, VR or their unique business approach (as you’ve read about in their employee handbook).
You said there is a big misunderstanding, but never pointed out what the misunderstanding is. How are we misunderstanding whatever it is we are misunderstanding?
I gave two examples. I mentioned that people believe an entire large room needs to be dedicated to VR when that’s not true at all. VR can scale anywhere from a seated experience all the way to warehouse size spaces.
I also mentioned that people think that VR is similar to 3DTV or the Wii when it really isn’t like either.
Bringing up points like those as reasons against VR like Kevin did shows that people generally don’t understand VR.
The misunderstanding in a general sense is that VR can be understood without spending time actually using it. It’s not something you can read on paper and understand. On paper it just sounds like you’re strapping a monitor to your face and it’s in 3D. It only becomes clear how poor that description is until you give it a go.
As an example, Tim mentions that he has tried earlier development and prototype headsets in the past and remained skeptical of VR. It was only when he spent time with the Vive that he ‘got’ VR. That flip in how he thought about VR could only happen by spending time using it.
It’s pretty common to see someone who thinks VR is a fad or that they’ve seen it before in the 90s only to put on a modern VR headset for the first time and be shocked with what they see. It happens almost every time I demo my Vive to friends or family.
That’s the challenge with VR – people just won’t ‘get it’ until they try it.
Hey Tim! I was hoping to buy a shirt in support of the study and see it has ended. Congrats on the quick success! Any chance you’ll have another t-shirt fundraiser soon? Thanks! Sarah
Thanks for all the awesome stuff you have created. I have enjoyed it and put a lot of it to good use.
Like a couple of other commenters have already said, I also think it’s a bad idea to promote the TM organization and its practices as they sound like a dodgey use of hypnotism to me:
Now, there may be something in using hypnotism as a hack for relaxation and health benefits, but it’s probably a good idea not to have people around who will tell you how great they are and that you should give them money while you are hypnotised…
I was stoked to hear you mention your visit to Cape Town and the Sports Science Institute. The man you were chatting to before your disaster pants episode must have been Tertius Kohn? I’m a Capetonian doctor specialising in clinical chemistry and spent a day being fascinated by Tertius’ work too. They do awesome work there.
Come back to Cape Town sometime! You have a following here, and besides that Cape Town rocks!
Could you open up sales of the mushroom t-shirts for those of us getting to the episode after the deadline?
Hey Tim! The guy you chatted to a Sports Science must have been Tertius Kohn? Awesome guy doing really interesting metabolic work! I’m a Capetonian doctor specialising in clinical chemistry and had the privilege of spending a few days learning from Tertius last year. I was stoked to hear you mention Cape Town and the sports science institute on the podcast. You should come back sometime – you have a good following here, and besides, Cape Town ROCKS! (We have The Mountain, and some of us even climb it!)
I’m a fairly new listener but have been seriously enjoying your podcast for the past month or so. I love this little break away from the more scripted-question interviews.
Anyhow, I wanted to mention that I tried the Headspace app after your recommendation in a previous episode and felt the 10-day sample was very effective. I signed up for a Vipassana meditation that I discovered several months ago through Chris Ryan’s podcast, so I’m curious how they differ and if TM is more or less effective. Not sure if you’ve ever encountered Vipassana or tried a 10-day meditation course, and your thoughts?
OMG. The augmented reality you made Tim Ferriss. Pokemon Go is certainly making a huge case for it. GREAT CALL. I wonder if K-Rose is sweating a bit.
Awesome show, love it when you guys get together!!!
A bit puzzled by the non-appearance of my lengthy and time-consuming comment re. transcription of podcasts. That detracts nothing from my genuine pleasure and education when listening to Tim’s great stuff, but my first attempt at engaging via this medium has not encouraged me to continue investing the necessary effort and time. A pity, but probably no great loss to other readers (or Tim, for that matter). Ah well.
I’m not sure what happened here, so my apologies. Perhaps it had links in it and therefore got removed by moderators per comment rules?
Hope all is well,
I’m sad that I couldn’t get a t-shirt…I have money that I want to give you :-p
Fun episode. I will check out that book you mentioned. I usually go to a book store, read some of the book and see if I like it. I don’t trust Amazon reviews and I think sometimes you promote stuff to do favors for your friends. I trust your recommendations most of the time but it is hard to know which one you truly recommend and which one you recommend because you are being nice to a friend of yours. Anyways, there are a lot of popular novels out there that is made of fluff. And some good ones never become popular. I have a BA in English Literature. I love reading novels. They can teach as much as self-help books, if not more. But you learn only if you read the hard ones. The ones that will take you to a different world, make you think long and hard. Those ones teach you a lot about everything (how people operate, how to deal with them, emotions, culture, history, geography, so on). A good, timeless novel is a treasure. The same goes for good plays and good poetry.
On another note, I like your article recommendations on 5 bullet Friday. Especially, the one about how much time we have left to spend with our parents was great. I ended up reading that blog for 2 hours. You recommended many good ones. So when you come across with solid articles please do share. Thank you. Best x
Tim: Can you reopen the psilocybin campaign? I heard the show after the date ended the deadline. There is more money out there and people interested in the shirts.
I’ve been listening to your podcast since my boyfriend got me hooked on it while on our west coast road trip a little over a month ago.
You do amazing work. Each topic you raise with your guests resinates with the chaotic brain activity I have going on as someone who lives a non conventional artist life style and being somewhat of an entrepreneur.
I just heard about you funding the research on effects of mushrooms on depression/anxiety.
While listening to the episode I thought to offer my collaboration as a fine artist in fund-raising in a form of embellished mushroom painting prints you could offer in addition to t-shirts, as this could catch the better financially established sponsors’ attention. I believe many will resonate with the image of the mushroom for personal reasons and experiences, and could enjoy the image more frequently by viewing it in their daily environment as opposed to only when they get to wear the t-shirt. The image would be done exclusively for your campaign.
Let me know your thoughts. I would love to work with you in contributing to the research project.
Great show guys. I guess I miss the video because I am more used to the visuals of the previous episodes.
Tim, in poetry I have found Haiku very interesting. Basho is my favourite. I have always wondered if Haiku in Japanese gives you the same experience or if anything is lost in translation.
Totally agree about Mohasin’s book. A brilliant work.
I’d love to support by buying a shirt but I came too late and the goal was reached.
I’m very happy that your goal was reached and I hope you found the answer to which method worked most in your favour, be it crowd funding or T’s. If there is ever a time when you need to raise more funds, or open this round for longer, to have a buffer or something, I’d support ;)). My hidden agenda is also the fact that I’d feel extra cool around my science-nerd gf wearing a mushroom shirt with chemistry on it… Just sayin’.
is it really too late to get a t-shirt?!?! I just listened to this episode but it looks like I’m too late and the campaign is over?? This topic is near and dear to my heart and I can’t tell you what it means that you are working to fund an area of research not sexy but so needed
I’m fairly certain this is the podcast where I heard about your fundraising campaign for research on psychodelics. You were interested in seeing if selling merch for funds would be better than traditional fund raising.
Just wanted to let you know how it’s going from someone who purchased your t-shirt. On top of being one of the most comfortable t-shirt purchases, I’ve found it to be a great conversation piece. Everyone asks me about it when I’m wearing and it gives me a chance to explain why I bought it. I think this method helps spread news about the cause while raising money for the research. Very satisfying purchase.
Long time listener of your show. Actually had a life changing experience taking mushroom in Amsterdam. You mentioned something about bringing more value to people to fund the campaign via merchandising. We actually have been providing sourcing procurement services specifically on the brand merchandising sector for Fortune 500 companies(BMW, Volkswagen, Heineken,etc) The merchandising model has been proven effective since every time users uses a product with functionality the item will register longer brand awareness during process. We would like to help to regarding this project just to pay tribute to the value I have taken from this community and your podcasts.
Any chance we could get those barrel sauna plans via Laird as you had mentioned in the podcast? I would be willing to pay for them.
Tim, you have so much great information and I listen to you all the time, but I’m now getting information overload and can’t remember what bit of information I heard from which episode. Please, please, please add some type of search function to your show notes so that I can find all the clips where the word “meditation” comes up or who it was that talked about goat whey protein. Just a thought. Thanks.
Half Japanese, half Italian, bisexual, architect, swim suit model?
Tim, you were talking about Yuka Otsuki!
She is currenty based in Berlin, a musician, though which is the same somehow.
Guy’s, you don’t “cheers” with water or anything else! You may “toast” with water, wine, blood or what ever floats your boat, then you say ” Cheers”!
Best episode ever, great show! Thanks to the three of you. No video required.
I would love it if you’d interview Steve Pavlina, in depth. I’m guessing that your differences would make a very interesting episode.
Great listen as always thank you. quick question, you mentioned tshirt brands you like more/feel nicer when marketing gear is printed. Do you remember any of the brands by any chance?
Hi Tim, I so related to what you were saying about T-shirts….sometimes they have great graphics or sayings but the T-shirt quality is horrible. I’ve been trying out how to source the best-fitting, softest T’s with good necklines. Can you suggest how to find them or go about finding them? What was your method? Thank you!
I’m wondering what the molecule is supposed to be on the Naturaleza t-shirts, doesn’t seem to be psilocybin or psilocin, and can’t find any other molecule looking like that..
Why worry so much about the permits for the sauna? What is the likelihood that anyone will notice, report, and generate an actual consequence from the powers that be? And would the cost of the fines be any worse than the permits?
I have a VC friend who made a killing putting up cell towers on tall buildings when he realized that the permits were more expensive (in time and money) than the fines would be, and that the likelihood of anyone reporting him was minuscule anyway. I don’t think he’s ever had a problem. And that was in high visibility areas.
I guess the real question is this: what were the calculations that went into deciding which option (to permit or not to permit) was more “expensive?” How do you weigh these kinds of risks?
Is there anyway I can still get the atoms-neurons mushroom t-shirt? Looks really cool and I forgot to order it until just now AND I think the John Hopkins research is way long over due and I’m glad you’re fundraising for it. Let me know and thanks for all that you do.
Heard the show, Just wanted to correct Tim on his psilocybin research details… Classification of Psilocybin is schedule I, which holds indicates “no medical value and high potential for abuse” which is where marijuana and heroin are also categorized. These also contain the hardest hitting court mandated jail sentences for possession.
Meanwhile, Cocaine is a schedule II substance, which have less conditions for possession. Derivatives of cocaine are used in things like root canals and orthodontics, while heroin’s close cousin morphine (Schedule II) is used in hospitals.
Tim, you mention a great book you read by Mohsin Hamid. I haven’t read that book, but agree that he is an amazing story teller and helps you see the world in a different way. I have been on a project with him and think you should dig into his background a bit to potentially have him as a guest in the future. He is unique as someone who has been able to carve out a role of story telling in large corporate America, coming from a more traditional background shifting to the creative world. Similar to Seth Godin perhaps, but with more traditional management background. Hope you two are able to connect and make something awesome. Appreciate your time in putting all this together for the rest of us listeners and learners out here.
Permutation implies order.
Tim, don’t agree wth your assessment that VR won’t face the same hurdles as the Wii, that they can easily translate first-person experiences like Call of Duty to VR without much effort.
VR is a new input like motion control is an input. The first Wii games coming out were pretty shallow in terms on taking advantage of the input. Same thing with VR and with a bigger issue: motion sickness. Translating first-person games that are on-par with what we play today requires a lot of work due to this new input.
Why no video 🙁 no video = fail !!!! We don’t get to see how drunk you are anymore..sad
I appreciated your honesty in declaring that you don’t know what you want from a relationship – or if it would include multiple people. So many people, myself included, are rethinking the restrictive structure of monogamy and even polyamory. I just “renegotiated” my relationship with my long term boyfriend so that we’re both equals and have no rules placed upon us about what we can do and who we can do it with. We’re sovereign beings and we should be able to keep that status, even in a loving relationship. So cheers to your next big experiment? Keep us posted 🙂
Podcast again 🙁
Video please…it’s so much better.